Join the NBDA and Bob Margevicius, Executive Vice President of Specialized Bicycle Components, for a webinar on supply chain management.

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The following content is accessible for members only, please sign in.

The NBDA has been here since 1946, representing and empowering specialty bicycle dealers in the United States through education, communications, research, advocacy, member discount programs, and promotional opportunities. As shops are facing never-before-seen circumstances, these resources offer a lifeline. Together, we will weather this. We at the NBDA will not waver in our commitment to serving our members even during this challenging time—but we need your support.

Now is the time to become a member as we join together to make one another stronger. Whether you’re a retailer or an industry partner, your membership in the NBDA is one of the best investments you’ll make this year. 

Learn more about the benefits of being a member and join now.

The post Within the Midst of Every Crisis, Lies Great Opportunities appeared first on National Bicycle Dealers Association.

Learn how high-performing bike shops maintain profitability with strict labor budgets without sacrificing the high quality of service their customers demand, with Jason Windsor, Head of Marketing and Customer Success at Retail Toolkit.

You must be logged into your NBDA member account to access the recording below:

The following content is accessible for members only, please sign in.

The NBDA has been here since 1946, representing and empowering specialty bicycle dealers in the United States through education, communications, research, advocacy, member discount programs, and promotional opportunities. As shops are facing never-before-seen circumstances, these resources offer a lifeline. Together, we will weather this. We at the NBDA will not waver in our commitment to serving our members even during this challenging time—but we need your support.

Now is the time to become a member as we join together to make one another stronger. Whether you’re a retailer or an industry partner, your membership in the NBDA is one of the best investments you’ll make this year. 

Learn more about the benefits of being a member and join now.

The post Wait, This IS My Circus: How to Control Labor Costs While Improving Customer Service appeared first on National Bicycle Dealers Association.

Frank McMillan – Founder of Ensure Protect, Developer of R.I.D.E.S. (Ride it Daily Extended Service)

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An industry veteran and visionary in leading real-time service contracts and insurance consulting.

Meet Frank McMillian.

Founder of Ensure Protect, developer of R.I.D.E.S, (Ride it Daily Extended Service), Frank brings years of experience to the mic.  Co-founding the first online real-time service contract solution.

Later adopted by Dell and Amazon, Frank brings to the conversation an in-depth look at his platform R.I.D.E.S, he shares the vision of the program, the profitability aspect, and the tools for retailers to implement now. More than service contract conversation, we talk about customer service, customer retention, racing sea otter, and all the personal bits that lend themselves to success.

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Frank McMillan

Tue, 3/9

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

rides, bike, dealer, people, sell, customer, bicycle, developed, shop, industry, service, cover, program, frank, buy, bike shop, thought, started, elliptical machine, consumer

SPEAKERS

Heather Mason, Frank McMillan, NBDA

NBDA   00:10

You are listening to bicycle retail radio brought to you by the National bicycle Dealers Association.

Heather Mason  00:16

Welcome to another episode of bicycle retail radio brought to you by the NBDA. I am Heather Mason, thank you for listening. If you’re a first time listener, be sure to check out all the previous episodes. Do us a favor and leave a review. It helps members of our industry find our podcast. Today’s guest is Frank McMillan, founder of insure protect developer of rides, which is ride it daily extended service and industry veteran there’s so much to say about Frank. He’s not only a visionary and leading real time service contract and insurance consulting, but he’s been married for 42 years. He’s an athlete who has completed over 30 triathlons. And he even developed a writable elliptical machine called karma. Once presenter at the bicycle Leadership Conference and an overall great guy. Welcome, Frank.

Frank McMillan  01:06

Thanks,

Heather Mason  01:07

Frank, it has been absolutely amazing to get to know you over the past few weeks. And I want to thank you for your support of the MBTA. Can you tell us how you got connected with the MBTA?

Frank McMillan  01:19

Yeah, it was it wasn’t easy. But it was worth the effort. I had gone to an Interbike show or two had studied the industry and looked at where we wanted to focus service contracts, which certainly wasn’t, you know, in target and Walmart and certainly wasn’t in sporting goods stores. It was for the independent bike dealer. So we felt we needed to find out who worked for the independent bike dealers and who was a great representative and advocate of them. And we found the NBDA. So we reached out and tried to get some meetings going it was difficult finally hooked up with Chad, and Chad hooked us up with your predecessor. So that’s how we hooked up.

Heather Mason  01:58

We are so happy to have you part of the MBDA. And I know Chad, he speaks so highly of your services. And so we had a phone call out last week you and I and I know you’re usually out traveling and in shops, meeting people. Where are you today?

Frank McMillan  02:12

I’m in Santa Cruz, California in our in our new office located over here. So it feels good. And you know, as they say out here, Surf’s up. No, there’s a lot of places to ride. We love it over here, we could ride the road highway one, we can ride them out Santa Cruz Mountains in the redwoods. So it’s a great place to have an office.

Heather Mason  02:30

Yeah, I think maybe I’ll need to come visit. So I’m so excited to dive right into this. I know you and I had a conversation this week about just your long and interesting career. And I know our listeners will find some great insights out of our conversation. But normally, like I do, before we get started, the MBTA is so thankful for our Association members. And this week, a good friend of mine Brooklyn bicycle company came on as an associate member and support. And I’m just so thankful for Ryan. And I know that he believes that his mission mirrors ours, and he is truly invested in supporting the bicycle industry. So if you want to connect with Ryan at Ryan at Brooklyn bicycle company, if you’re an IBD, looking for another brand, I highly suggest that Okay, so Frank, this past year, everyone’s been kind of starting a lot of the conversations. Have you been this past year? How is your working environment then with COVID? Did you have any adjustments or any issues this past year that you’re kind of still I don’t know, struggling through or have motivated you and the 2021?

Frank McMillan  03:32

Yeah, I think we’re coming out of it. But we’re a high touch third party administrator, when we roll programs, we like to get out into our dealers and help them understand not only how to communicate to their customers about them, but actually how to sell them how to do their systems integration, that type of thing. And we were Believe it or not, in the middle of a rollout in a dealer that has 125 stores that we rolled out March 1 of last year. And and I had to pull everybody out on March 13. Because COVID just started taking off, they’re located in the Midwest. And you know, I think they thought they were potentially impervious to it. And it became obvious that they were not and so we pulled our team off. And so that means that my team became really adept at go to meetings and you know, zoom meetings like we’re on right now and that type of thing, but that affects our ability. The other thing that dramatically affected as we just rolled out right at a couple p two meetings, introduce the people at the end of 2019. And and so we thought oh 2020 Here we go. And then you know, as we know, the independent bike dealers had to deal with this huge increase of people that found biking again, is huge increase of service and then this huge unavailability of bicycle product of the supply chain just got whacked. And so I think people were a little bit reticent to spend time learning about a new program. Make their time available for us. So we were really happy that things are settling down a little bit, and we can get back out there and talk to people. We’re enjoying some beautiful rollouts right now.

Heather Mason  05:09

Well, Frank, I mean, you and I have talked a little bit about the rides program and the rollout to bike shops, but I had no idea about the timing. How like this past year affected the rollout. So I want to know so much more about rides, but I, I’m like such a simple person. And you put this term out that was third party administer TPA, for people who I have no idea, can you help us understand what that is?

Frank McMillan  05:33

What does that yeah, this is, this is actually super important for our industry, and what separates us from our competitors. So I’m glad you asked that. If you think about an extended service contract or repair with maintenance contracts, there’s actually five different parties involved with that there’s the consumer, right, or the end user that’s going to buy the coverage, right, they want to cover whatever their product is, in this case, the bicycle, you know, whether it’s $1,000 bike or a $5,000 bike, it’s still their bike, and they want to ride it right? In trusted a dealer to to put them into that bike. Instead, the dealer has represented to that consumer, this is what your terms conditions are, this is what your coverages are. And the consumer pays that dealer a sum of money, let’s say 200 bucks, right, there’s some sum of money. And for that, they get now the coverage, that dealer then reports that sale to a third party administrator, we would be the third party. That’s right. And our job is to not only create the terms and conditions, right, it’s not only to manage the data of the consumers that own these things, so that we can find them service, right, whether that’s the dealer that sold the tune, or if they’re traveling somewhere, and they need service on on their bicycle, because it breaks when they’re out and about on vacation, right? The third party administrator manages service manages data and manages the risk Association and and all these things that can customer thinks they’re buying, well, that third party administrator, hands a lot of the money that they get paid from the dealer over to an insurance company, right. And that insurance company stands behind the product, they’re obligated, by law regulated to hold that money in a reserve fund that has to be available to pay for the claims or the services that the consumer thinks they bought from the dealer, right. And the administrator managers that they’re the fiduciary, between the dealer and that that insurance company, right, and the fifth party is the service center, right? So that when the customer’s product, Grace, and that service center services it, okay, they get paid, they get paid out of that reserve funds that the administrator manages. And so what happened in our industry is a bunch of the administrators got purchased by insurance companies. So you think about if an insurance company owns IT administrator, and it’s a public company, the administrator is obligated to try to make money for the shareholders of that insurance company that is not conducive to great customer service and saying yes to claims it’s conducive to trying to figure out potentially how to find the exclusions and say no, right. And that’s not a healthy relationship, as far as we’re concerned. So when we saw the industry changing, in 2015 2016, we said, you know, what, we need to bring Administrative Services back to the industry, right. And we developed, our company focused on writing programs that make sense for the industries we love, right? I’m an avid biker. So we developed the rise program, when we found out there really was not appropriate programs out there, because the programs were out there were being presented by insurance companies that own service centers, or not their own service centers that own you know, administrators, or administrators that are selling directly to consumers and trying to cut out the retailers. Right. So, as an independent third party administrator, we developed this program, the rise program in such a way that that you’d be comfortable selling it to your grandma, right? It’s like, she’s really getting coverage on her bike. She’s really getting annual maintenance, there really aren’t a bunch of exclusions, right? It’s, it’s something that covers what it should cover. That’s what it’s about, and our insurance. Our insurance company loves it because we didn’t underwrite it and go out inexpensively. We developed the program First, the one you’d want to buy or the one you’d want to sell, and then we priced it, and then we brought it to the insurance company actuaries they signed off on it, they’re comfortable with it, and that way we can afford in the program can afford to pay the service center which in most cases ivds have their own right, they can afford to pay them their shop rates, their going rates, their posted rates, just like it should that way the consumers always be in terminate, you know, there They become the priority. Right? They’re well taken care of, and they love it. They feel it, they definitely feel it. So. So they’re lost? Sorry, a long answer. No, it’s short question. But that’s what a TPA does, we make sure that a consumer gets taken care of, and that the money is paid to that service center for doing the work. That’s our jobs.

Heather Mason  10:19

Yeah. Frank, I, I’m so glad that you, you know, took the time to explain that because it really, it really puts that like authentic human connection in that customer service focus forward, and that what you’re offering is a great product. So for our our bike retailers, listening, you know, stay tuned to learn more about rides, which is a program that you can offer at your shop, and consumers who are listening, pay attention to learning more about rides, and go to your local shop and tell them about this. So there’s lots of good information we’re going to get into here, Frank, I know you’re an athlete, and I want to know, just kind of your past you started in retail, like, how did you tell us a little bit about your career path?

Frank McMillan  10:58

Yeah, I was I was a from a family of seven. And the folks were, they were from the depression generation you worked. And you know, I was you know, from went from the paper route to retail, so and TVs and stereos, which I really loved and my first trainers, here I am. 17 are teaching us along with these stereos and appliances, you’re going to sell these extended service plans. I’m like, wow, we can make more money doing this. This is great. But I’m the kid in the class that raised his hand and said, Well, what do you do with the money? How did you figure out what to charge? Because I’ve always loved math. And they’re like, the trainers are like, well, that’s really not appropriate to this class, you know? Yeah, it is, we should know that. But they cut me off. The next day, the owner of that company called me and said, Hey, we understand you asked some questions in this training class, how would you like to learn and they flew me to LA, it was my second slide ever in my life, they flew me to LA, and spent a week teaching me about loss ratios and risk and in all kinds of neat stuff, frequency and severity that I used to this day. So I accidentally became a warranty dude, when I was 17. And then that carried me through my path, we developed warranty programs and extended service programs all the way up to 1989. We had an earthquake here actually, in Santa Cruz, that, that wiped out three of our stores. And that was the best career path was a long time in retail running these programs, both at retail and on the risk side. And then Transamerica on the pyramid up here in San Francisco, after that earthquake, call this up and called me up specifically and said, hey, how would you like to help us launch an extended service planning program? So that’s when I went into insurance. That’s how I got into the insurance regulatory side.

Heather Mason  12:41

That’s such a cool story, think that your unique way of thinking you know, your questioning actually got someone’s attention, right. And so the conversations I’ve had with you every time I’m taking notes and writing down stuff, because you just drop all these, like, really insightful ways of looking at things. So I can and I know, part of what arises is like, you’ll go into shops and train the staff. So I think that’s amazing. But you mentioned to me earlier that you created some service contracts solutions that are even adapted by Dell and Amazon. Tell me

Frank McMillan  13:13

Yeah, so. So in, in 1999, I had been the Senior VP of this big administrative company called back and in 1999, myself in this current CFO of this company and CEO of this company, we were co founders in a company that developed a real time delivery system of extended service plant quoting right so if you think about 99 everybody was coming out with with.com right? dell.com buy it now. Calm amazon.com you name it right.com was exposing overstock.com that was an early really big one. And you’re probably too young to remember that the reality is, is we wanted to level the playing field between.com and brick and mortar we want to enable.com to sell extended service plans How could you put it in there? How could you populate it? How do you flag the right products? And how what is the database look like? So that when a customer clicks on a product, it reaches out and delivers back there, their manufacturer’s warranty and the options to buy extended plans right so we raised 25 million bucks we developed this stuff and we launched 119 different key dealers we ended up selling our company off couple years later which was pretty cool, but that’s what that was was first real time voting delivery system and you see everybody with it now you go on to buy your insurance or this or that everybody’s got all these real time voting mechanisms online. And some of them are made from, you know, our original programs, so it’s pretty cool thing so um, I do know overstock

Heather Mason  14:52

now, Oh, my gosh, I was just brainstorming out as you were talking right there, Franken. I’m thinking about rides and I’m thinking about when we talk about To our IBD retailers about their online presence, and I’m wondering like they’re selling bikes online for pickup on in store, can they add the option of the service contract online? Like I? Yeah, that’s a thing that we should talk about eventually.

Frank McMillan  15:15

Yes, yes. So the currently, our associates and friends in the NBDA, they most of them seem to use a one company’s ability or solution to deliver their stuff up well, we really should do is integrate with those people so that when people sign up, and they want to push a button to have that show up, you know, we can take you on to some of our current clients, and you can see how their delivery comes up. We haven’t had a ride stealer implement that yet. Because I think they need to rely on smart detailing, I believe, to go ahead and do that integration. So maybe, you know, you and I can make a call to them and figure out how to do that. Because that would be a great benefit for those dealers. If their customers see that opportunity to buy a rise. They’re going to ask about it in the store, when they got to pick it up. It’ll just it’ll just increase the attachment rate. I’m sure.

Heather Mason  16:10

This is why I love just talking because we come up with the next the next thing, right?

Frank McMillan  16:15

Exactly.

Heather Mason  16:17

Frankly, think we got to like just rewind that a little bit. Because you and I know what rides is and I’m so excited about it. I’ve never personally like when I had my shop, we didn’t offer service contracts. But can you for our listeners, for our listeners who own bike shops, what is rides? Exactly.

Frank McMillan  16:34

So, so rides is an extended service program. Okay, that’s what they’re called extended service. It’s not an extended warranty. it differentiates itself from an extended warranty dramatically because manufacturer’s warranty basically cover defects in materials and workmanship. Well, if you extended that, you’re not going to cover things like wear and tear, you’re not going to cover annual maintenance, you’re certainly not going to cover accidental damage. Right? So, so rides was developed thinking, Okay, I’m a writer, how many times have I gone over the bars? or How many times have I, you know, broken this or that? What would a rider need? Okay, so rides covers, essentially, just about anything you think, can break on your bike, right. So you wear your chain out, it’s going to be covered. You go over the handlebars, you break your levers, or your shifters that’s covered, you jump bottom, your shock out that’s covered, you’re hauling down and downhill on your on your road bike, and you go into a turn and talk about your wheel. Because your spokes weren’t tightened up enough, that’s covered, right, it’s a program that was put together, that retailers can look their customers in the face and say, Look, you’re buying this bike, you may or may not know how to maintain it, but we can maintain it for you here. And on top of that we can offer you coverage that the manufacturer and frankly our competitors do not. And when the when the dealer sells that to a consumer, they will attach that plan to the bike in what whatever was installed on that bike of the time, that creates a value of the bike, and they sell the plan. And based upon the value of the bike, the price of the plan is determined by the value of the bike and the length of coverage that a customer wants. So currently, the options and wanting some coverage are two or three years from the date of purchase. And the reason we don’t started at the end of the manufacturer’s warranty. Instead, the date of purchase is because we cover things that the manufacturer does not like I was saying so you know, you can take your bike out, or you’re from upstate New York, or where I was just in the Midwest where it was like I storms and freezing. There’s people that go out and ride in that stuff. They use the fat bike, the fat tires right there not to ride with studded tires, or you fall over you break your hanger or you damage your bike that’s not covered by manufacturer in the in the dealer should have to cover that. But what are the customers do they covered? You sold me this and it didn’t keep me up, right? In this case, the dealer can sell it, they make about 50 points when they sell it. And when the customer comes in, they don’t have to say hey, that’s not covered, right? What they get to do instead is let’s take care of, you know, they just go look up the customer validate they have coverage, go ahead and create the work or in get authorization for that do the worker and we reimburse them their posted shop rates for doing that. So whether it’s a repair, that’s just from wear and tear, or whether it’s a repair from accidental damage, or whether it’s an annual maintenance, you know, they’re going to be reimbursed for that. So they make money when they sell it. They make money when they service it, but to me, the most important part is that they hold on to their customer. Yeah, because of a customer. If a customer has a brake on a bike, there’s nothing that guarantees if they’re going back into the selling shop. They might go to they might go to a closer shop somewhere else who knows you know, try to find Find a cheaper alternative and stuff if they have rides attached, guess what, they’re gonna come back into that shop. So it’s a way to hold on to your customers get returned business in the shop while you’re working on their bike is what they’re gonna do. They’re gonna buy how much they’re gonna buy new clothes, they’re gonna buy that cool shirt, that somebody sells to raise money for their local people, they’re going to who knows what they’re gonna buy maybe a new set of pedals, maybe some new tires, they’re gonna buy other stuff, right? There are things we don’t cover. There is fine print, but it’s simple. It’s abuse and misuse. acts of God right. So if there’s an earthquake and it gets smashed by earthquake that’s not covered. And then consumables. In our case, the consumable list is really short, right? It’s literally no baloney. It’s stuff that we should consider consumables, it’s it’s tape on handlebars, that wears out, it doesn’t affect the operation of the bike, it’s your tires, and your tubes, right? Those are consumable. So we like to just say, it’s cosmetics, it’s consumables, and it’s rubber. That’s it, that’s a pretty easy way to get that point across. We do cover rotors, we do cover chains, right, we cover what we should, you know, you break your break your seat posts, because you’re hopping off something and you come down too hard. After your voice drops down, or you learn how to talk again, and that the C post needs repair, we’ll go ahead and replace that C post for you. So we’ve covered a lot of stuff. There’s a lot of neat stuff in there. We’ve covered in bikes. I am cool.

Heather Mason  21:31

I’m loving listening to you talk and I and I wish our listeners could see you because you are so enthused, I’m seeing it I’m like, and the way you describe the accidents that could happen when you’re riding or the parts of a bike. Did you develop rides? Because of your athletic background? What is it like three Iron Man’s and 30 triathlons? Like is there a connection there?

Frank McMillan  21:52

No, there’s not the you just asked me to send a bio. So I had to send that but I I developed rides literally because I was in my first interbike shows. And I walked around and I found a couple what I thought were really poorly developed programs for the bicycle industry. And being a you know, being a 40 year underwriter, I get masks, and I understand what frequency is how often something’s going to break in, I understand what severity is, what’s the average cost of stuff are and how you develop rates. So the way that you can develop a cheap warranty program is you could just not cover a lot of stuff, which will lower your frequency. Or you can play flat rates, which will lower your average severity, right? So so you can go out with a program that covers less, but that’s not beneficial to the consumer. And it’s really not beneficial to the retailer selling it, if he has to say, well, that’s not covered, right? If the retailer is able to look customer in the eye, and say, Look at this program, they’re going to get behind it and they’re going to sell it. So when I was at interbike, I’m just like cheese, there’s got to be other options. So I started investigating found an OEM program out there that I thought needed some work. And I said, You know what, I’m going to develop this program and started to work on it. And then you you know, when you do that, as an administrator, you have to find the appropriate insurance company that wants to stand behind. So you have to develop those relationships. And then the filings are wild. I mean, the amount of filing you have to do to be able to sell it in all the different states where where the NVDA dealers are. That’s that’s quite an undertaking. Expensive undertaking, but, but we’re good. So I developed it out of passion for the bike industry. I am an avid writer, like you said, I’ve done a bunch of those, but my big passion is mountain biking, I like to get dirty.

Heather Mason  23:41

You know, that’s why we get along so well. Frank. Okay, so you have several shops are using rides right now, what are like some of the feedback you’re hearing

Frank McMillan  23:57

the the shops are digging it, the people that are selling it or digging it, they find it simple to sell, they find it easy to administrate, you know, to get claims on, they’ve requested that we develop some phone applications that make it easier to do stuff. So we’re working on a bunch of back end stuff. We just developed some quick ip whitelisting to make it really easy for the shops to come in and just look up a customer and validate that they have coverage. So the feedback we’re getting is they love to sell it. They love the profit margin. It’s simple to report. They just want us to continue to facilitate the back end, but a little bit more. But I think everybody you know, always wants that to happen. And yeah, for the most part, I think it’d be talked to you know, some of our original members that came aboard, they’re going to tell you we’re pretty easy to deal with on claims and stuff. You know, stuff. I’m happy to give you their names, but I have a feeling you might be reached out to them anyway.

Heather Mason  24:51

Yeah, no, Frank, that’s that’s great feedback. You know, you just contributed recently to our outspoken blog. Thank you for that. And a lot of the article i thought was centered around This thought of impeccable, undeniably excellent customer service and in how you feel like rides really offers the shop the ability to offer that like at the heart of at the heart of it. So can you walk us through like that thought pattern? I know you contribute to the blog, but not everyone reads that.

Frank McMillan  25:17

Well, you know. So, yeah, which they should I agree, but what I am, I think what I’m trying to get across is one thing that that makes bike dealers especially independent by dealers way different than your typical retail that has cashiers ring and stuff up as people come through, you know, the aisles, that type thing is by dealers, first of all themselves. Love the industry. That’s, that’s what I find everywhere. But secondly, they develop a rapport with their customers they go through and they properly qualifying, who’s going to use it, what are you replacing? How often do you ride? What kind of riding do you have? What are the bikes, that they develop a q&a with the customer that makes the customer feel comfortable, you know, as opposed to walk in? Hey, do you carry e bikes? Yeah, they’re over there, right, and then the customer doesn’t know what they’re looking at. But when it comes to ivds, they spend time with people qualifying them so that they can pain in their head, what are the two or three options I’m going to present to this customer and when they present to you let them do the test ride or whatever they’re going to do, that’s excellent customer service, they make sure that they get the customer into the right product. And then they go ahead and get them the right accessories, they know how to add on, they know how to tell the customer, you know, you really shouldn’t leave without this set of gloves, that helmet, the right type of riding shoes and clips if you need them. You know, if you’re riding in a cold area, let’s sell you all this new premium stuff. So they understand suggestions selling cross selling, add on selling, I could go on and on upselling. But that is important because this is another accessory for them. It’s another product that helps complete the deal. And that’s what I love about working with bike shop. So I mean, we do programs that are made, you just ring up at the register, they scan them they’re done. And you know the customer grabs that we sent a little documentation The next day, here’s your deck page and your terms conditions. But bike shops are different. So so we love bike shops, we love the way that they treat people in. And so we’re committed, we’re going to do training, you know, we’re going to give more version of how to integrate that in there. And we’re going to ask them questions, how do you deliver this and we try to integrate our training with their approach their customers, culture is a big deal. Customer Service culture is a big deal. And it’s going away, you know, if these dealers want to separate themselves, from Amazon, or from the bike OEMs that are selling and competing with them, whether it’s online or open a shop across the street, you know, how they separate is by excellent customer service, and then top it off for the rights program. You know, that’s the way I look at it, it is it is a value add, that’s valuable to that consumer is valuable. That shop owner is valuable to the service guys in the back. Everybody’s weighing in on this thing. And it’s priced in such a way that it makes sense. So so that’s that’s might have been too long of an answer. But no,

Heather Mason  28:12

no, I can’t, I can’t agree with you more especially we’re talking about the new cyclists from this past year who have found our sport, right. And it’s so critical that their experience at the retail environment and with the IBD has to be has to get them ready to become a cyclist it has to leave them like just easily entered into the sport and like just a bike shop has their back and then they feel supported. And this is exactly what you’re saying. It’s it’s giving them all the tools to be a great cyclist. And then if something happens to their bike, or if there’s a failure, they can come back and then they don’t have to worry about it. Like it’s just seamless.

Frank McMillan  28:51

Exactly. Yeah. So in the bike and the bike shop owner, I’m gonna play on what you’re talking about new cyclists, they may have expectation that a bicycle is like the wireless phone, right? Here, nothing’s gonna happen to it, you know, oh, I broke my screen, I’ll bring it to the mall guy. And we’ll put a new lousy screen on there. That’s not basically they’re electromechanical devices, you know, nowadays, I mean, they’re definitely mechanical nowadays are often electromechanical. their expectations are not necessarily based in reality, this type of product in in the it behooves that dealer, like you said, to prepare those people. And part of that is to talk about, you know what, I want to make sure you understand the manufacturer’s warranty covers this, we’re going to give you free annual maintenance or whatever that dealer to and by the way, on top of that, we have this program which will enable you to come back in for an annual maintenance or three depending on what they want. And if you’re out trying some new writing, that you’re not quite prepared for yet and you fall over in But setting up pretty good. We’re even going to cover that though I really you know, cuz you notice people buying new bikes, lots of them buy a more expensive bike because they envision themselves being Superman and riding anywhere they want. And then they find that they don’t quite have that capability developed yet, and it’s nice to have rides there to go with them.

Heather Mason  30:19

Yeah, I that’s it, I really hope that our listeners really keep that point is that these new cyclists that are coming into the sport, have no expectations, they don’t know anything. It’s really your spot to educate them and provide them that you talked frank about retaining customers and how when shops offer rides, and they have customers who sign up for it, they’re automatically going to be coming back to their shop. But is there any way that offering a program like rides can attract new customers to someone shop?

Frank McMillan  30:48

Absolutely. So in a couple ways, if you’re out looking for a bike, and you’re online, nowadays, some of the online searches, show the customers the different shops that have that, that bike in stock, right? If they walk into one bike dealer, and that guy is just trying to sell them the bike, and that’s it, and doesn’t give him great service. And they walk into this other dealer and find out that they can protect their bike, that’s a great way to steal a customer from another bike shop. And it really is, I mean, that gives you an edge. If the customer is shopping online, oh, I think I’m gonna buy this because it’s $100 cheaper, or you know, whatever their driving thing is, but they realize, you know, when they’re in that shop gray, you know, you may buy that online, or maybe the shop has a price matching policy match. You know, we may match that price for you. But we also want to make sure that you get all the accessories you need and the rights. This is just part of the thing that separates them from their competitors and separates definitely from the big boxes, right, but separate some from online for sure.

NBDA   31:54

Bicycle retail radio is supported by our NBDA members, all our member benefits can be found at nbda.com. Join the NBDA today.

Heather Mason  32:06

Thank you told me once, I think we were having maybe a quick phone call that you had just taken a call from someone who had like been on a bike trip and broke down and needed to find a shop locally who took part in rides for repair.

Frank McMillan  32:20

Well, we’ve done that actually quite a bit. So I was probably talking to you about a young lady that bought a bike from Johnny velo out in Ohio. And this young lady and her best friend rode across country, literally went out to Oregon, and they wrote across country and it was really cute. We were getting calls from her dad, oh, my daughter’s out there, you know, you really can’t have her call us directly. You don’t have to translate. You know, it seems like all those calls came in at five or 6am on Sunday mornings, because she’s waking up, she needs your bike to make her miles that day. It was cute. I mean, we were able to fix your bike in Washington, we were able to fix it. In Oregon, we were able to fix her up in in Montana, in the middle of in the middle of you know, National Forest, she actually got a ride from the Ranger to the nearest bike shop. It was like the coolest thing.

Heather Mason  33:16

So she was taking advantage of her rides contract that she had signed up for and then finding the shops to go to based on that.

Frank McMillan  33:26

Just call us up and we’re asking, okay, what’s your issue? What’s going on? And we were calling shops, and going Hey, because remember, this is a time of COVID there were some shops that were backed up. 3456 whatever that time is we call them up say, Hey, we have this young lady, we really need you to get her in this morning. You know, if you could they get all excited? Oh, I have a daughter, you know. So sometimes, sometimes personal touch is a lot better than an app, you know, because an app you’re just going to look through and that type of thing personal touch by somebody that is in partnership with a dealer and looking out for the best interest of a consumer can be super cool.

Heather Mason  34:06

You know, that gives me goosebumps to hear. That’s that’s impeccable customer service, for sure. Frank, I’m gonna put you in the hot seat. So give me the lowdown. And I’m sure shops are like, okay, they’ve got step pricing. How am I going to make money? Like if a shop signs up to offer a program like rides, then where are we gonna make money off of it? Like it’s good for the consumer and good for the shop? I mean, how can it be good for everyone?

Frank McMillan  34:32

Yes. So so the way the way it works is I talked about frequencies to vary. So we’ve calculated how often people will get claims and what the average cost is. So here’s here’s how it works. For a shop. We know if this is offered to 100% of the people. Most of the shops offering right now are closing about a 3030 plus percent attachment rate. But there’s a rule in our business called the 20 3050 rule, right? We know if you offer to everybody two out of 10 people By plans on everything down, right, whether it’s their phone or car, you know, you name it their computer, they buy a plan. So offering it to 100% of the people, you’re going to get a 20% attachment rate, right? 30% of the people don’t like them, they’re like you, they don’t buy them, you know, you didn’t you don’t buy them. That’s probably why you didn’t offer of, I’m guessing you might buy him you might have on me on the hot seat, I put you right back on the hot seat. But the other 50% of the people buy him when somebody takes the time to explain and tells him the value of the program and that type of thing. So if you’re a retailer, do this math, if you close to 33% attach rate, or just call it a 30% pass rate. And the average plan is 50% profit, right. And the average plan is about 200 bucks, it’s simple math, but it comes down to you’re going to add about 6% revenue stream at a 30% attachment rate. Because the average value of the plan is about 20% of the value of the selling price, the products you sell, you’re going to add about 30 about 6% to the revenue stream at 50 points. That’s that’s really good. And the dealer, the NBDA dealer is not paying up front for this, right we we waive the signup fee for them the integration fee everything else because they’re part of the NVDA. So they they get the supplies, they get the training, they integrate into their system they offer to their consumers, they report their sales to us weekly, monthly nightly, what it depending upon the size, right? And they pay once a month, right? So they hold on to the revenue, they pass 50% on to us we pass part of that to the insurance company, right? So you’re asking, how does everybody make money? Well, we know a certain percentage of people are going to get me a certain percentage of the people are going to have accidents, or they’re going to have failures. And we know exactly what their percentages are. And the pricing is developed on that if we’re wrong, then the insurance company has to stand behind that they have to take the risk. If we’re right, then the amount of reserves sitting in there should go down to zero should be perfect, you know, other than their margin, right? If we’re too high, then there’s going to be something called excess reserves. And that will enable us to lower the price moving forward, it will be based upon data. So calculating any rates right are are based upon numbers and data. That’s it right. But you just watch it, you watch it earn out and you adjust it where needed. And everybody’s in good shape, the customer is going to be in good shape, because they’re insured, they meet all the regulations and all the states the retailer is in good shape. Because he made money, we saw that he’s going to get paid shop race because the insurance company is obligated to make sure that those guys get paid whether or not they run out of money.

Heather Mason  37:53

Well now now I feel a little bit I mean, listening to the data, right? I feel a little bit foolish that I didn’t consider this before for my for my retail environment. But sometimes Frank, it’s like, it’s like the rolling out something new rolling out a new program, like what I’m trying to do everything as it is, you know, as a small business owner. So do you help with that? Do you like I don’t even know, how do you interleave? If a shop wants to sign up? What are the next steps? Like? Do you help them with their hang tags for the bikes? Or is

Frank McMillan  38:22

Yeah, so we send the shop. So let’s talk about that. So that we send the shops, brochures, we’ll send them as many as they need, you know, generally speaking, we send about 250 per location to start, right. But if there’s something like crazy, we’ll send the bar we’ll send a blast. And if it’s a if it’s a big company will private label it, we’ll leave and tweak the program a little bit to meet their needs, their pricing needs, you know, their their sweet spots or their sales, right. But we’ll send them the brochures, we’ll send them hang tags, and we send them the counter cards, the counter cards are pretty cool. They just stand up and say just about anything that can go wrong with your bike is handled. So it’s visual aids that they can use to sell. Now on top of that we train them either on go to or face to face, right. And they get they’re entitled to face to face training, if they sell over 1000 bikes a year, which for some dealers, they’re sitting right on, right there selling 100 bikes a month to just under that. And we’ll do face to face training for those guys. If it’s smaller than that, then it becomes difficult for us to rationalize the visits, right, just from an ROI standpoint,

Heather Mason  38:30

virtually as far as these days. Right.

Frank McMillan  39:32

What’s that?

Heather Mason  39:33

I was just saying virtually we can do so much to like, you know, you could just get on a call.

Frank McMillan  39:38

Yeah, for sure. So So the biggest challenge that we seem to have from some of them is how do they put their their skews into their system. So there’s two primary systems out there that seem to be in use. One is the Send, right, those generic shoes are already in that system. They did that for us. They have a customized program that obviously They’re going to need to put those skews in the system if they’re on lightspeed, which seems to be the other one, same thing, right? So the ideas you need to load in your skews, the cost of those skews the retail, you want to sell those that we have suggested retail, the brochures that they can price it any way they want, right? And then they should put the description. Is this a two year? You know, with one maintenance? Is it a two year with three? maintenances per year? Right? Is it a three year with one? So that’s that’s the setup there setup is to get the skews in the system, so they can sell it and make some money? Yeah, and report those sales to us. These are what we sold. Here’s the bikes. We sold it on. That’s it. So that’s the biggest challenge for them not selling we’ll get trained up, we’ll get them trained up, we’ll get into supplies. They’re they’re in business, but some of them, you know, I’m like, this is like you said,

Heather Mason  40:49

Yeah, like, I split up my day, like priorities, right. And sometimes, like I tackle the easier things even if they’re not priority one, don’t tell anyone. But you know, like the major things, the big priorities, like the ones that are gonna make you money, those should be the ones that you sit down. And it sounds like if someone sits down in front of their POS and gets these skews, set up and get that done, they’ve tackled a big priority. It’s pretty easy to implement from what you’re saying,

Frank McMillan  41:13

Yeah, we just rolled one dealer. And he he was so funny. He goes, so do you have these excuse? I go, yeah, the skis, you’re on brochures, but let me send you the skews and the costs and everything, make it super serious. It’s on your agreement. But let me send you a really simple integratable one that’s already got product descriptions, everything else I sent it over to me, he goes, Oh, this is great. Because I sent it to him in Excel. And I set it to CSV. So he could he literally was able to upload it directly into a system and he was selling the next day.

Heather Mason  41:45

Yeah, I think Yeah.

Frank McMillan  41:47

He integrated on a Friday he was selling on a Saturday.

Heather Mason  41:50

I think sometimes in our brain, we make up these like, Oh my god, it’s gonna be so hard to get this going. But once we sit down and do it, it’s actually Oh, that’s not that bad. You know?

Frank McMillan  42:00

Yeah, it’s and for dealers, it can’t pull reports out of their system, right, which for some is more difficult than others. We even have a log on, where they can log on to the web, and manually enter and then there it is put in there in there, what’s installed, they put in the price point, it has a drop down select plan that you sold, give us the customer’s name information at the break information that automatically uploads into our system, we turn that into an invoice form. So if they don’t have the ability to pull it out of their system, push it in the file format. We’ve created a an online app for them that page, it’s super easy. It’s just a dealer log in and away they go.

Heather Mason  42:37

Yeah, that’s awesome. So and thank you for working so closely with the MBTA on rides, it’s the means a lot to us. So as I’m listening to you, and I’m also thinking, Okay, this, like Frank’s got so much everything I throw at you, you just like come back with an awesome answer. But you told me you presented at the bicycle Leadership Conference once What were you present on? How was that experience?

Frank McMillan  43:00

It was, it was customer service in house service contracts integrate into that for not only income, but customer retention. That’s what it was about. So I know Franco Hannon and some of the different people over there. I even raced in the sea otter three times. And instead of BLC, it was just a presentation, you see people get up there and digress. So but I do want to share siata with you so. So I consider myself in pretty good shape. And at that point, you know, even for an old dude 62 I’m active. And so at that point, I had just finished my first diamond and I was training for my second and I was feeling really, really good. And I’m like, Oh, I want to race cars cross country. So they have the pro division. And then they have you know, then they raid a 12345 and I’m thinking I’m a one I’m gonna you know, I’m in such great shape but, and I get out there in my age group. And I’m looking at these guys and their legs are like this. I didn’t realize they were like pros that just didn’t want to race in the pros, right? I should have been into a four or five. So I get out there and I take up and there’s a there’s a section at 20.2 bouncers section that where you go down the sand, and I snapped, I snapped my chain. So so first of all before before we started the Laguna Seca Speedway, if you’ve ever been out there, right, yeah, it’s incredible. So it’s all foggy in the morning, we take off and I am like falling behind and all these guys are disappearing into into the forest before I’m even off the racetrack. And I’m like, wow, these guys are really fast, you know, and I’m like going, so I ended up breaking my chain, fixing my chain breaking the chain again, towards the end. And I come in and the announcers like Well, what do we have here? Wow, an hour and 10 minutes behind the last finisher and his crew Frankly, I came in last place and they thought I had sagged out or disappeared or walked away and shame and said, I finished that thing. That was a really good experience. I went back and next year he came in last place again. And then the following year, I actually, you know, raised in the group, I should erased it, but that’s great. I can’t wait till we get that event back again.

Heather Mason  45:24

I was gonna say at least you like did it. And I love that you shared your story. It’s

Frank McMillan  45:29

pretty funny, I think.

Heather Mason  45:32

Oh my god. So 42 years of marriage, three kids amazing career, I know you’re well networked in the industry. Because, you know, everyone seems to know you. Talk to you. So any great tips you want to share that you have learned throughout the years?

Frank McMillan  45:47

Yeah, first of all, be nice. That’s those two words carry a long, long bond way, right? number two’s the sales thing that we learned, which is listen, if all you’re doing is present, you’re not listening. And you’re not thinking about your customers, or your family, or your friends, or your representative. So I can go on and on about that, right? And then participate, you know, be be part of this solution. If you got something to complain about, figure out why you need to complain about it, instead of being part of what fixes Sony, you know, I’m not, I’m not the smartest guy in the room all the time. But I think being raised in a family of seven kids and marrying into a family with six kids and, and just being around a lot of people all the time you realize there’s huge diversity within your own home. Right? There’s huge diversity within your own family. And if you embrace that, you’ll embrace the diversity when you walk out of your house, you’ll brace the diversity between dealers in Florida, Louisiana, New York, upstate New York, New York City, Wisconsin, Arizona, Southern Cal northern Cal, you talk about differences, you know, the choose to embrace differences in culture. And if you do that, I think you really get to enjoy life, you know, your fear level will just go away. You know, if you’re if you’re curious, and you enjoy being surprised you’re you enjoy learning things, you know, you don’t know about I think that’s it. So that’s for the dealers, just listen to your customers, you know, ask him some stuff, you know, maybe throw a personal question or two in there. They want to be important. If you ask questions, people feel kind of important, you know, I should just talk about them. So I don’t know. I don’t have that much. From from a management standpoint, treat your employees like they are fellow business people respect that. Don’t Don’t assume they know everything, you know, right? You can’t take 40 something years in business, hire a new kid and expect them to just get it by osmosis. So to me, our job as adults are our job as as business owners is to help our young people see an opportunity in an industry and maybe look up to us a little bit that this is you can combine fun with business right that there’s there’s things to learn, you know, what, what is inventory turn? What does it mean? backorder? What does it mean? How long to come in? How do I plan my store? What’s the right product mix? Why do I have this product mix? You know, how do we reach out to our customers and advertise and then talk to your young kids ask them how they reach their fellow people right? How do we bring new people into the industry I’m I’m fearful that the bike industry will age out like I saw the consumer electronics industry aged out, you know, it’s like what happened to the service, the servicers, the guys that would work on appliances, you know, what happened, you know, we need to make sure that the NBDA the dealers need to make sure that youth is brought into this business I love what a lot of these different companies do and organizations do to teach young people about the industry go out and learn how to be a tech and this and that we can do that internally in the stores those of us that need the text and need the service we’re happy to write checks and get involved with these dot orgs and do what we need to do but as business owners think about that, who’s going to follow your story you know, I don’t know what your exit strategy or whatever it is, but it may be just selling it to the kids that you’re teaching to be wonderful business owner so that’s probably way too long to answer you know, there’s so much to go on with

Heather Mason  49:36

Frank again, I think your insight is spot on there and a focus of ours at the MBA has been to really try to reach the individuals within the shop and make them members to so we can better educate the individuals you know what you say succession I know that a lot of employers need to look at their employees as potentials to take over and further this business and industries. But you know, all of your background I we haven’t even talked About karma, the elliptical machine that you so you were involved in creating this machine and you brought it to interbike to introduce it correct? Is that what I remember? You told me. But that gives you such a unique perspective from this side too, because you kind of really bet on every facet of the bicycle like industry and this customer service experience, right? Would you say?

Frank McMillan  50:21

Yeah, I think that the manufacturing side is too much overlooked by people how intense it is. And so, me and two of my brothers and one of our best friends are all avid skiers, I belong to a group of guys called the rods, which are the radical old dudes, and we, we ride together and we ski together. And during certain months, if you’re not skiing, you still want to stay in shape. And the elliptical machine in the clubs is a great way to do that. And we’re like, That’s stupid. We live in California, why don’t we got to go to a club. So we we invented karva, which was a race, elliptical machine, you know, two wheels on the front one on the back, we had different gearing, we electrified it. And in order to do that, develop the right steering mechanism, which we ended up patenting, we had to spend a lot of time a lot of blueprinting, one of my brother’s a CNC engineer, he’s like, brilliant, Ted, one of our priorities is brilliant. And we started to design a sand course, my job was to deal with the warranty and the regulations and the legal stuff, and all that kind of stuff. But we spent a lot of time once we developed the product that we like, we spent a lot of time in Taiwan, we spent a lot of time in China, meeting with different manufacturers to have it actually made. So we understand the bomb process. I mean, starting with nothing, creating stuff out of just metal, taking it into the different types of alloys and different stuff, we wanted to use, developing it, patenting it, bringing it over sending the designs going over and looking at the first design selecting the manufacturer we want putting the orders in, right the big checks, having that stuff load up into the containers coming across unloading it ourselves

Heather Mason  52:01

so much going on.

Frank McMillan  52:04

It was like a great experience in selling the heck out of you know, putting up a website, and so on and so on plans, of course, extended service plans. And that was a great experience. So when we, when we talk to the guys in the shops, we talk about it from Yeah, I get it, I understand why can I understand why you may need to substitute that piece for that case, just goes to take care of it. And we also understand what they’re going through right now. You know, the supply chain is nuts. You know, we have this big program, big program in the firearms industry. And people shoot the farms, they need to maintain them, right, they need to do field stripping, cleaning. Well, you talk about a decimation to an industry you walk into this partner of ours, this one company sells hundreds of 1000s I mean, hundreds of 1000s of guns, right? And they’re their shelves are literally 1/10 the inventory right now of what they’ve had. I mean, it’s starting to come back but they’re all using the same metal they’re using the same stuff that you know, a lot of bikes are, you know, so So what’s the moral story sell high end bikes, so carbon fiber

Heather Mason  53:13

service plans, right? If we don’t have enough product, this is another way to make revenue, right? So

Frank McMillan  53:17

exactly, I mean, add add to that, and then and then people can take they can afford to take care of the bikes that fail. You’ll keep that customer till they’re ready to buy a new bike and that’s a beautiful thing.

Heather Mason  53:28

Okay, Frank, last last question for the hot seat today. Give listeners retailers who are listening one action item for today.

Frank McMillan  53:40

Complete the merge of our brand new micro Are you talking about for them or for me?

Heather Mason  53:48

Don’t Give them yours.

Frank McMillan  53:51

For all of you guys. Sorry about that. Your action item today is to give us a call. And in sign up for rides. You know, do it give us a call ask questions. I can even give you that phone number, but I bet you Heather’s gonna give it to you so well,

Heather Mason  54:06

Frank, I was gonna tell people to learn more about rides on the MBTA website. But why don’t you go ahead and give the phone number I don’t know it.

Frank McMillan  54:15

It’s it’s 8664 rides and rides is spelled ri D e s on the phone number so we can make it seven numbers. That’s pretty easy. Remember 18664 rides, you do that? It’s gonna come into us? We’ll answer it. You may even talk to me as I say

Heather Mason  54:35

Can they talk to you?

Frank McMillan  54:37

Yeah, you there’s a good chance you’ll talk to me it’s it goes into you know the systems it goes into your system and you hit one you say you know I kind of baloney But well, we’ll take care of you real quick.

Heather Mason  54:48

Thank you have been great. Thank you for sharing about yourself and your business and for your support of the MBA and our retailers for supporting me. I mean, these past couple of weeks. We’ve definitely been in Touch quite often. So thank you.

Frank McMillan  55:01

Well, thank you. Yeah.

Heather Mason  55:04

It’s not the end. But that is it. Thank you for listening today. I invite you to connect with me and come on bicycle retail radio and share your story with our listeners. Lots of love for our industry. There’s lots of great webinars and member networking meetings coming up. If you’d like to support the show, don’t forget to subscribe to the show on Spotify or Apple podcasts, share your favorite episodes, with your friends and on social media. And thank you for listening. See you back here soon. And with this we go.

NBDA   55:34

This has been bicycle retail radio by the National bicycle Dealers Association. For more information on membership, and member benefits, join us at nbda.com

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The NBDA has been here since 1946, representing and empowering specialty bicycle dealers in the United States through education, communications, research, advocacy, member discount programs, and promotional opportunities. As shops are facing never-before-seen circumstances, these resources offer a lifeline. Together, we will weather this. We at the NBDA will not waver in our commitment to serving our members even during this challenging time—but we need your support.

Now is the time to become a member as we join together to make one another stronger. Whether you’re a retailer or an industry partner, your membership in the NBDA is one of the best investments you’ll make this year. 

Learn more about the benefits of being a member and join now.

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The post Frank McMillan – Founder of Ensure Protect, Developer of R.I.D.E.S. (Ride it Daily Extended Service) appeared first on National Bicycle Dealers Association.

The NBDA has been here since 1946, representing and empowering specialty bicycle dealers in the United States through education, communications, research, advocacy, member discount programs, and promotional opportunities. As shops are facing never-before-seen circumstances, these resources offer a lifeline. Together, we will weather this. We at the NBDA will not waver in our commitment to serving our members even during this challenging time—but we need your support.

Now is the time to become a member as we join together to make one another stronger. Whether you’re a retailer or an industry partner, your membership in the NBDA is one of the best investments you’ll make this year. 

Learn more about the benefits of being a member and join now.

The post ADA Compliance: Protect your business from lawsuits, Open your website to the world appeared first on National Bicycle Dealers Association.

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Brett Flemming

Tue, 8/18 10:43AM • 1:05:54

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

bike, client, Fred, ride, brett, buy, mechanic, bicycle, shifting, middle-aged guy, hanger, store, service, shop, BMX bike, mountain bike, seminars, fun, experience, brand

SPEAKERS

Fred Clements, Rod Judd, Brett Fleming, Chad Pickard

Rod Judd  00:10

You are listening to bicycle retail radio brought to you by the National Bicycle Dealers Association.

Fred Clements  00:17

Welcome to the NBDA Bicycle Retail Radio Podcast. I’m Fred Clements I’ll be hosting today and I’m with Brett Fleming the famous Brett Fleming. He is a master mechanic and trainer who has at least 35 years in the bicycle industry and 15 as a service manager of a multi-store group up in Portland, Oregon. But his roots are farm roots I believe Iowa Brett and he’s not really efficient.

Brett Fleming  00:48

I was a Navy brat, dad wanted to give the Midwest experience too. So I was hanging around with kids from the Philippines and Guam and then next thing I know I’m in correction Ville, Iowa. More That story later. It’s not afraid. Yeah. So but I ended up there. So I went to high school honored. Yes. wonderful experience in the Midwest.

Fred Clements  01:09

Okay? You’re the owner of efficient Vela tools, which is pretty well known in the bike industry inventor of a number of products available through efficient below tools. The easy lift, the safe zone mirror, the right arm of work stand. Clamp,

Brett Fleming  01:25

right on the lap. Yeah. And

Fred Clements  01:27

I’ve known Brett for a number of years from seminars he’s presented and really it’s a pretty powerful message, a unique message, I think in terms of service writing, to how to turn your service department as a bicycle retailer into something special, or where customers feel welcome and nurtured. And which brings up the concept that I’ve gathered. Brett from your past. Aggressive agreeability is something I’ve championed. And I wondered if you might sort of giving us a primer on aggressive agreeability

Brett Fleming  02:00

Thanks, Fred. Here’s the perspective. I’m speaking if you’re a bicycle service professional, and even a motorcycle service professional because two-wheeled vehicles have such dynamic that requires high interaction, so we’ll take it from that perspective. Right. So as a professional mechanic, I was always trying to get hired by everybody that came in the door. And to them, I tried to submit a resume and treat them as if they’re the most important person in the world and make a show about it. And let them know instantly that they had the entirety of the resources of the company right to butt off, correct. Who would do anything for them? And when I saw that heart go to every single soul, the person digging cans in the dumpster that needed a flat patch, because they couldn’t afford the tube. He was right there for him with the same level of dignity and Soozee Azzam and fairness and I just copied him and I get emotional about it because it was fun and important, and people can die. And people have extreme joy and kids run around on pushbike. Isn’t that cool? two-year-old carving turns. That’s when I finally left retail. And that was pretty cool, wasn’t it, Fred, the joy can spread so many different ways now to try to everything, you know, the mountain bike crowd, you never want to ride on the road, fine, I support them, whatever you want to do, if your interest snooty, you know, $10,000 bike, fine, I support that. If you have no money, I’ll support that too, with a smile, because it’s always working. It’s easier if you greet the mechanism with kindness, enthusiasm, and support and let the client know that you really want to help them. And thanks, David, jack for that word. When a mentor gives me something great. I copy it. That’s all. The thing that was really terrible for me in school is I did ever copied I never teach. It’s really, really hard. And I barely ground through high school. You know, and I did it though. But in real life, you didn’t cheat. You get to say to the customer, how do I get an A on your test? Give me the answers now and I’ll just give them to you if I can because that’s what we’re trying to do here. With love. And enthusiasts and in fairness and why not because you’re trading a massive part of your life for money jobs are crappy. Wouldn’t I’d rather be on my farm anytime now because I got myself a little Lakeridge. Right. That’s more fun than a job and, but why not make the job as fun as you possibly can and that’s what I copied from bud Albrecht age 95. I checked in with him recently and here’s his answer, about aggressive agreeability. I said, bud, I worked with you for 15 years I’ve worked with grace for 15 years, but I’ll break the first 15 Jay gave last year 15 and amazingly Jean Osborn for a couple of years and by cracking between and he’s the guy that taught me retail professionalism and using technology. He was a retailer first bicycle guy second but holy moly. He built a beautiful store but anyhow I called but I said I gotta get it from your mouth. How come when I was there, in all the world where we say You know, sometimes you have to fire a customer and you know the customer You know, they’re just riding along and there they don’t know nothing. I never saw you disrespecting anybody button and I never saw you say, get the heck out of my store and never want to see you again. He was all Yeah, you just never argue with people if you argue with somebody, they get mad and you get madder. We’re trying to get hired. Don’t argue with people. Even scientific argument feels like an argument thread. Well, something bent the hanger. The law of physics indicates otherwise, force acting upon another person’s life. You know, I don’t all that stuff. But some Newton would have something to say about it. People don’t care about what Isaac Newton knows and what the whole, you know, the reasonable scientific world knows. As far as they were concerned, they’re just riding along. So I’m going to agree with them and say, yeah, that’s how it is, man. You’re just riding along and you’re just going into low gear or something where you’re doing that because it’s horrible. This is a catastrophic deal, man. Sorry, it happened. But you know what, sorry, it happened a bunch of BS. Fred, you know how my stand is on the hanger, don’t you? the hanger. Great everything. If a customer bends the hanger catastrophic Lee and destroys the derailleur, it’s your fault is the dealer. And if they did in the right dealership, they would say, you know what, Fred, you were right. The bike only fell over in front of the coffee shop. I didn’t check for the scratches as you taught me. Doggone it. And it was shifting funny. Like he told me and Doug did it, Fred. When I went into low gear, it went into this book, just like you told me and destroyed it. This sucks, Fred. I’m sorry, it happened. And Doggone it, you told me and he also told me it wasn’t gonna be a warranty, Fred. So here’s the deal, Fred. I’m kind of screwed. You have this brand new bike. So I have to pay full retail for everything. Is there anything you can do? Can you talk to these people and help me get a better buy on the frame? Or can you help me find a repair source or something like that? right because I know it’s no warranty. I’m not asking you to eat it, but could you help me right now? Just to answer that question as a human being, could you would you do that for me? Would you advocate for me? You know, as usual?

Fred Clements  07:10

Yes, we will help you. We will help you. We’re here to help.

Brett Fleming  07:14

Yes, exactly, exactly. It’s like hey, but that doesn’t happen. Instead, we make fun of them because they were just riding along when a hanger bends and allows the director to go catastrophic Lee and we’re the spokes and then the rotational force destroys you know, hanger sometimes the frames wheel that is an avoidable situation that has cause and effect it doesn’t just happen riding along you know, okay, it feels like that. So the client you have to honor that so it’s always like honored the feeling spread. The aggressive agreeability is if the customer is mad at the bike or if they’re mad at the company, get mad with them. That first set the alignment that they know that you care that Jeepers, yeah, I want to this sucks. I want to get back on my bike. I agree. We have loaners we can get you going. And let me deal with the baloney of the dealership. You know, it’s usually not covered under warranty. But let me go to bat for you, right. The words that you choose I could never illustrate this well enough in my seminars I patched together while having a busy crazy life.

Fred Clements  08:17

professional service writers professional mechanics, serve the client, not the brand. The mission is the customer. Everything else follows from a well-served customer don’t chase the money first serve the customer and the money will follow. Does that make them good and

Brett Fleming  08:35

correct but don’t serve the customer in the standard fashion. That is the rule. each client has to be viewed as if you want to survive in today’s retail establishment. each client has to be completely hands curated. Friday went in to buy a few but my local dealership in took to my new farm in Chicago, Washington. I call it the no sigh ranch. I got a little half-mile mountain bike loop I do each morning and then walk the dog in my stream and it’s wonderful. And the retail there is actually pretty darn good because they know it’s a small area and they can’t screw up because small towns so I’ve had some pretty exceptional experiences I went in to get to my mountain bike because I have thorns on my property and fixing flats all the time. And as a professional you should know even as millions and millions of flats that I’ve ticked they all suck in their massive massive barrier to get on a bike and riding for anybody for me or for anybody my crippled hands I think about the pain the change in tubes and I haven’t done it millions and millions of times but in the I go to the local bike shop and I want to buy it too It’s not one of them slime filled tubes and what the fattest one I can’t cuz I don’t like them suckers stretching out and I kind of gave him some specific information. And I said I would advise them SPD mountain to size 41 standard pleat, not SPD but that brand that type of you know, like a mountain fleet to different brands. I don’t mention that. He did it and I said I’d like the cleats roughed in and I think I really appreciate the threads grease, but I really want those counters to think bolts. I want the countersunk areas to grease because that’s the part that’s all creaky when you try to break it loose five years now in Oregon dust. So it was fun because they said that’s how we do it. And they were really agreeable, right. And then the best thing was Fred, you won’t believe the bike. They had a chrome connector with GM grips and pure GM tires. Right? You get the pictures that were there doing that where the GM rubbers remember like the brake hoods of diet calm. And Camplin, yo. It’s like that kind of GM rubber on the tires and the grip and had a free coaster. And I said to the young man, that’s three coasters on the 509 99. like yours. Yep. So they’ve never ridden one Can I have to get down? Can I try it? She said, Yep. He got into town. You can kind of tell like I can kind of say like, he can kind of tell that I knew a little bit about bike. And so then I said, What about this one bike here and I said, I want one of those modern numbers because I said I just have a lot of reasons why I want one of these. Do you have one of these in a small because you know I’m an odd guy. And so he said no but I get when I said I’d like to get one of them I just bought a bike for $1,300 tax included all in for everything and all kinds of cool stuff at full retail because he deserved it. And that shop turned it and it was warm and inviting and welcoming and clean and the restroom was perfect and there’s clean fresh water to drink. And he was nice and he didn’t dampen my enthusiasm one bit but only allowed it to happen. And that’s what you can get from a tube to a multi-thousand dollar sale and I’d never done it Eddie Grayson attitude. You know, but it was beautiful and couldn’t believe it Fred and I got the super bind you bite with a dog gun, dropper seat book. I love those things. They’re the best things in the world both to get yourself a BMX Park riding a bike in one second and like a massive turbocharger climbing unit and the next because I get some gravity money Place. Holy smokes I’m 600 feet in 2.4 miles, it can be a 1500 plus. And it’s just so steep. Anyhow, I’ll talk about that later. But see, that’s the new experience that’s available to me. So because of my bicycle addiction, which this is where we can grow our business with clients, specifically, you want to really do some compounding and top of line business, get people hooked on different types of cycling and running around on two wheels, three wheels, four wheels, I don’t care. And you know what I cried out loud. Fred, when I was climbing with the first time on my property, he’s got some clear cut and different prairies and stuff. So in the book I call Sun Prairie, which is 250 steps to the steepest part of my property. So it’s just like eight floors of climbing, and I was going up there on my mountain bike in the lowest years harnesses possibly could and when I tipped over as a 58 year old duffer, the steepest part of the hill, I cried out to words lithium-ion Because we need to embrace everything that’s available to help people have a Stokes time. Because if you were at my level, in my property in my area, you would think of riding a bike because it’s as hard as it can possibly be, for me to go up for pitches on my road straight up without switchback in it in the lowest gear, anybody I got the lowest triple the new 12 on the back kind of a deal. And that experience is available to me and you know, then when I played with that free coaster, do you think in the back of this old bmxers mind, I’m going to wonder what it would be like when I’m bored in my shop or trying to think of a problem of tooling. When I rally around my shop with a BMX bike, wouldn’t it be kind of fun at 58 years old to learn how to go backwards on the bike because a free coaster bike lets you do it. And I could watch some YouTubes and tinker around and then have you know minor blood trauma injury like usually happens on BMX bikes, but I don’t want that anymore. Anyhow. Yeah. So here’s the other thing with aggressive agreeability and like it’s mainly like trying to get hired. Don’t forget that you’re trying to sell your services you’re trying to sell you, because the Internet has all this other stuff available. But what I got at this shop, you wouldn’t believe it. The first time I bought my bed in the break. I said, Oh, we got this huge disc on the back. I don’t know why they put some 200 and some millimeter diff on the back of this monster mountain bike. So it had a sickness anomaly. So it just grabbed and I thought maybe get pine SAP, maybe embedded it in. I’m trying to give the benefit of the doubt the company is like two hours on it. So I went to the shop and I said, Hey, I need to have you guys Marty just because they know who I am now and I never told you that. They figured it out a certain point. There’s three guys in the shot. It felt so good. Fred’s in the old days. You know, you’d go into a shop and get disrespected to some bald middle-aged guy and then got your bike that I know something about, like this whole situation. But they were really cool. And he after a while he goes, he said I figured it out. And then the guys in the back came out it right our plants in their shop. That was really cool. But I didn’t come in and say hey, I’m this guy in that Guy and I’m looking for a bro deal. And I said I only have two rules. When I shop with the local people I pay full retail for everything. And I don’t ever expect free labor or anything like that I pay full price on everything. Because as a community member, that’s great because we live in a state where we have a no-tech state right across the river. So in Washington, you better darn well be on your game because you got to punish the client or not. The client has beautiful roads and whatever we have in Washington because there’s some sales tax. So it’s beautifully collected over here, but you can go across the river and not have it well. If I choose to shop on this site, I better get something more for it right then Fred? Oh, man, I’m happy to pay the taxes. I don’t have to go into the city and back across the state line, the ridge that clogs up a little bit and I can have an experience and you know what, you know what he said as I last year, I said I love you guys. I said I got a local bike shop now and he said to consider it your third space or something like that. But then modern youngsters would say you know, so I go in there now and feel their way Water. And now I know I need an extra-large helmet, you know, setting a stocking cap under it. And they hooked up this brake pad problem, the brake disc thing and they did exactly what I wanted. I said that’s too big of a rotor for two-wheeled vehicles Give me something smaller. And there’s a cool spacer under the caliper and they said decent. I said can’t this cannot do that. And they said, yes, it can take care if it’s a different rant. Heck, no, I just want to go. And they said, Yeah, here’s this 180 boom. And I’m really happy with the rear brake on the pipe. Because when you’re going down the steep pits and your brake is grabbing, you lose all your security because you don’t want to get the tire and all of a sudden now, every time it rotating around, and you know, the thing about middle-aged guys, that is important to middle-aged gals or people that as we age, it isn’t about Guys, please. But it’s like the older we get the higher the consequence. So to support people, we have to enhance their skills and understanding of the vehicle as an obligation. That’s part of the safety package. In other words, yeah, you do the work, but then the human has to operate it and it’s not you. Those are some fun The mentals right? Have your work checked by someone the best test writer in the world is the client. You know, if you have a critical situation, I always invite the client in scheduled basis to come on and say, Hey, come on in here and your stuff and let’s go for a ride by your coffee. Because Doug on this trip would drive me crazy to Lady. Let’s get to the bottom of it. Right? And it’s just a little lubrication under McClure’s. You know, it’s just a little lubrication between she’s willing to do it, and it’s done. Because we did it together with her shoe on her bike, see, and that’s what it is. And when you have a victory like that with a client, say just you own them, and I don’t mean that in a bad way. It’s like you own their safety and their experience. And you get to like say, How do you feel what is the maximum experience for you? I never wanted to over 30 miles an hour down the hill. Well, we’re going to make sure your breaks are top of the line because you’re going to right now remember that you don’t have Do it once because if your hands both get cold and you can’t do nothing, you might not be able to stop. So figure out a way to, you know, use one for a while and then the other to kind of give one hand a break and a shake, you know, but never be caught with him too cold to just grab a break and stop if you need to. But you keep using those breaks down the hill, because if you don’t like going over 30 you don’t like going over 30 now you know me, Fred. That’s just a little blip. When I’m on a hill, it’s fun and exhilarating to go fast down the hill, but it’s not my duty to try to transfer that enthusiasm to other people, right. That’s not how professional My duty is to say if you’re scared going down hills it almost makes me emotional, because you could get hurt.

Chad Pickard  18:42

Have you signed up for a ride a daily extended service yet? What are you waiting for? It’s the extended service plan for your customers that pays you your shop rate for extended service and warranty claims. rides are only available to NBDA members and it’s only available at NBDA calm

Fred Clements  19:06

A good question for you, Brett would be, you know, as a service writer, as a bike retailer, you have all sorts of people all sorts of experience level all sorts of attitudes good and bad. You have said in the past stop thinking that customers are doing something wrong, even when they are, it’s your job to manage feelings, and to deliver possible action. It’s not your job to be right.

Brett Fleming  19:30

Yeah, here’s a good example like words matter. And one of the little word tracks I’ve never perfected, but here’s as good as I’ve got. So let me let you in on a clue about shifting because I’ve really struggled with shifting myself until I found out the one thing that’s an absolute fact, if it makes noise, it’s something I’m doing, that I might be able to and probably can do differently to not have noise. And I can be highly interactive with what’s going on precisely when that poor chain being asked to ram from one raw sprocket to another. It’s tricky, and it takes technique and understanding. But Doggone it, every time I make noise, I’m a kind of a gearhead, I can trace it back. I promise scientifically, there’s some little tiny thing that I could have timed differently or pushed a little this way or that way a little better. And it kind of sucks. But this is part of the game. And nowadays, it’s a lot less of a problem because let me tell you that we can make it a lot less about finance than we could before because we have some really terrific shifting vehicles nowadays. So it’s easy to deliver a precisely shifting vehicle provided you know hangers or Street and things like that.

Fred Clements  20:39

You’ve suggested never argue. So that raises the question to me. What do you consider arguing

Brett Fleming  20:45

what is arguing? arguing let’s start in the kind of in the way arguing should exist in a scientific argument, right? You know, a hanger titanium hanger takes 70 kilograms and force them. That force comes from somewhere. Isaac Newton says so You wrecked it. You were not covering it. Right? It can be that simple, right? That’s the truth. The company’s not going to warranty it. You know in the way I know it took 70 kilograms force when I knew that how fun it was to do the garage-style inventor and meet the engineering team met some guys with Shimano when I said I invented the derailleur hanger that they patented it ultimately and I said this titanium hanger take a lot of force to the to Leslie’s tongue. And the engineer from Shimano said yes 70 kilograms. I laugh I don’t know how you know that but it’s mass and respected. Don’t be you know, buggering up the argument even scientifically like, well, something dentist lady, you know, and it’s not covered. We’re still not going to cover it. Whatever, you know, none of that stuff matters to someone. So, but arguing would be well, you anything that makes him feel bad to hear. Let’s put it this way. It’s all about feelings for me because I’m trying get hired. And nobody wants to give money to someone that’s mean to them or not nice and inviting and helpful. So instead of like defining what arguing is, just say, I think I can kind of sum up how by Trump interaction. If someone walked in and you’re, you know, like, I was playing with some ladies that I was with two ladies that one of them is 50 and her sister similar age, and I said, Okay, usually ladies walking the bike shop, what’s going to happen? You know, someone might say, Oh, you need a cruiser hybrid. You know, and yet I say how did they not know that you were like, near bronze level, you know, swimmer or you know, downhill mountain type champion. They just can’t guess the people by that’s the first thing you never ever, ever do. Ever, is just people, you know, around because I went into a name the names of bad ones. I went into an Italian motorcycle dealership that very famous I was really curious about the WBC or some other brand of the airbag, you know suit, full airbag suit for motorcycle and you know how am I motorcycles? I got a few. Me and Fabio, he’s done the gorge. That’s my big joke. He owns property about 30 miles from me. Hey, you have a lot of motorcycles too, but, but I was under the suit in the dealership that cost $5,000 that I probably could afford. I wanted and I heard a compelling argument. And it meant the EBT could go on and case by off on one of my machines and airbags maybe save me and some guy sells me that argument. I would have bought it that day. But instead, I saw the CarsGuide Burton with the espresso lady. And then I stood under every gleaming Italian jewel with halogen lights. beautifully you know illustrating middle-aged guy. Yeah, six-figure income finally fit Nobody ever talked to me. Not even once. Everything was like I went now then it became an experiment of ignoring like, you know, I wonder if they would know. And then I had already driven upon an exotic Italian motorcycle brand new. I’m interested in this stuff. You know what, yeah, zero points for them. You know, and, you know, I had a heating and air conditioning person where they first started doing what I call like chopping the tree down one branch at a time. I walked up and is randomly showing me the ohms output on the Start capacitor for the compressor on a brand of heat pump to cheapest on the market. I just took it the garbage and buy a new one. So he’s doing that. Are you doing that? And he was checking the fuses on a 220 line? Well, if it was running, and it’s too funny, even one fuse out it wouldn’t have been run. And so why are you checking the continuity on the fuses and he was training some young guy and they were 15 minutes early. That made me mad. They said that 843 or 743 they said it’ll typically come early. And I said, Well, how early Are you saying, quarter till so that means you’re in my driveway, and I’m in my robe. You know, that’s how they started it all. Be on time. Keep your word. be simple. And then ask people what’s important to them. Ask people where they are in scale. Say, Hey, thanks for coming in. female clients, middle-aged, not racer body style. I don’t know nothing about you. I don’t care about your gender or nothing. Because guess what? Your hominid that’s gonna be dinking around on two wheels or three wheels or something. And I don’t know nothing about you. But I know a lot about bike and this kind of stuff and XYZ. And if you need some help with it, by golly, I’m the person right here to do it. So yeah, instead of arguing it’s like aggressively just say Hey, take care for coming in. Retail test these days, we have to make an impression on people. How can I just get right down to it and listen to you in a way that’s meaningful and efficient, and help you accomplish your goal? Now, I know that too cheesy and too tan, but that’s what they should feel right? That’s what I’m trying to push is the feeling that and I think

Fred Clements  26:17

you’ve given some talks on words to use. Do you have any words to use words not to use sometimes, you know, you don’t want to just someone has a need and you don’t know much about them. Are there some good words or ways to get into a conversation to know more about their needs? Fred, Fred.

Brett Fleming  26:38

You bring a bike in. This is like, hey, let me get to. First of all, I tell the sales people in the store to be scanned in the parking lot. They even remotely see someone coming in with a service bike. They dang well better get off of that internet. And run out there and say I’m looking for an excuse on this beautiful sunny day to get outside. Tonight. Hold your hands up. If you’re taking it to service, I can guide you to that awesome team and they’re ready to help. See, this has got a sticker on it. smartstore is that did you buy it from us? Yes, I did. Awesome. Well, thank you and can I help you with that getting into the okay with that? Sure. Sure. Hey, next time you load this in your trunk if you don’t mind I’ll give you a piece of foam that we use in that bites compact list and and we could put that on the lip of the trunk right here. And then that would keep it from scratching the bike you know for the occasional haul another bike if you do it a lot, you know, you probably would invest in the car rack eventually or immediately whatever you know, but we’re not talking about that just second let’s get this bike in. Just talk to the service soul you know and say Hey, tell me a little bit about it. You know what’s going on the bus is in trouble getting their truck gun it would you rather be out riding it? Well, yeah. Well, I was riding long and had this business right. Well done. done it. Let’s get that right if and if it’s anything made, let me just tell you how this works. We can do most of this stuff since you got it. My Thunder this You know, generous little situation, we really are committed to getting everybody back on the road as fast as possible. We don’t care about the rules. 30 days, this 90 days, that two years, you want to ride We are the barrier removal, folks. It has to leave here. I want you to know, we even have loaner bikes available. You have a routine. Some people have a routine, we’ll make sure it doesn’t get interrupted. You can live without it. You got others makes it easier for us. So we’ll figure this out. Now tell us what’s going on. And let’s see what we can figure out right? Yes, about words. You know him, right, Fred letson. We were not I in them. And the other thing that I really would like, whenever I talk about some little lesson that I’ve learned, I will respect the brands, if that’s okay, right? Because in the 60s Schwinn had a neat program in one of their books, you know, we could hear better if we got, you know, fresh in the horse’s mouth. But to summarize, they said when you build your service department, make sure that the service area is elevated so that the client like is presented into a workspace It is at an elevated level so it’s respected and important. So words matter and little teeny details matter. Like, don’t you ever hang a bike on a saddle nose in my store if you’re a professional because that’s not professional work, you could damage the bike that could fall off that you expose everybody to a lot of risks because you’re doing a lazy procedure because you’re not planting the vehicle securely mentioned in the BMW dealership as you know, we consider these cars on one forklift, Fred, check it out. I just shove a pallet under here. And I can get that BMW lifted with this forklift. Is that going to inspire confidence with the client? No, you know, it’s important to show them some respect. And if the bikes not we’re fixing you know, members. Let’s get doing my seminars where we just lay the magnet or the Pacific down on the floor in front of the service counter with both of us shaking our head like it’s roadkill. Would that ever feel good to anybody regarding Just have their station in life or the bike. No showing some respect and say, Would it be okay, okay, there’s a Pete Slotnick, when I give him, I can give you some great things A to Z, there’s the Z. Pete was a massive fan, would it be okay? If we put your bike in the stand. And when we do, because of these type of clamps that we have, we have to change your seat height to not hurt the frame, or the beautiful paint here is we want to carefully approach how we touch your product. So the other thing about word they have to be based in extreme respect for two types of property, friends, physical property of the bike, it’s theirs. You don’t have permission to touch my bikes ever, ever. You know that mountain bike did a drag do this trade show spread the only mountain bike I made for me with this decal of Brett blending on seat and back in the old days I actually had a million times on the seat tube who ruined the seat tube decal Pretty good, right? But there’s still some Stubbins of Brett Fleming on there when I built that baby in 1983 and I still ride it today. Well, if I sent that to a shop and they grabbed my already ruined decals and ruined a maroon deter that’s gonna really hurt my soul. Because they don’t have a right to. It’s my property, you know. So that’s how you have to have extreme respect for property, even the Pacific in the magnet. Oh, there’s another line, right thread. This bike ain’t worth fixing. Here’s the interpretation. I bet this bike got a lot of stories to tell enthusiastically presented right. And then Would it be okay if we put it in the stand and have a look and see if she’s totally a goner, or not? Sorry for the sheep. Have you seen a fan? Let’s look at this together. You and I both know this bike is dead. Can we bring it back to life in a way that works for both of us and is reasonable, right? Because I’m here to sell your service. I’ll take your money all day long to take this family heirloom. Hey Fred, members what you know, it’s a question I asked at every seminar. These are fun words. every bite mechanics horror, what we wake up at night, you know, the rusty magnet from the beach house that grandpa used to ride the dogs around the cul de sac. See, we didn’t know that right? So we know the rusty magnet from the beats comes in. And that’s bike mechanics are looking at that bike. And we all say, I don’t want to work on that one. I don’t want to work on this a Junker right, like a dead terrible bike is not worth fixing. Allegedly, right? So they come in and they have all three other shops in town said that’s not worth fixing. You know? So they finally bring it into my shop. And they say, Hey, we got to get this thing tuned out. And I say, yeah, alright, let’s take a look at it and see it’s pretty rugged shape. As you obviously know, hey, here’s the deal. We can fix this up to any level, you know, because my job is to sell your service. What’s the story on the bike? You know, tell me why you’re requesting the service search because I want to make sure that I recommend Something if you want my recommendation that’s appropriate to what you’ve got going on. Instead, I get to say it’s not worth fixing. And they say, Well, my dad died. And he had this bike at the beach house. And we always told him, he was gonna get killed on it, because we told him to get a dang tune up on it. And we know it’s not worth anything. But it’s dogs still alive. And it likes to go on the same ride and each house, you know, condominium complex deal and we thought hell would die if we ride the bike the way dad did. Can we at least pay these guys to make it so it can stop in the tires hold air. So we can take old breaths around the neighborhood one more time. So I get emotional and I tell that story because don’t mess with people’s property. That’s emotional. That’s mental, that’s physical. And there are so many blessings available to us. If we say you know what, we can never make these breaks safe. But if we put new ones on it will be safe. Okay, we don’t care. Dad buy it for hundred dollars and then Magna. We don’t care. Don’t you tell me I can’t have my dad’s bike, ride my damn dog around my neighborhood to see how it needs to be handled sensitive, but you can just so destroy somebody by disrespecting them and their property. So find out what the story is. And if it’s beat to death, to say a bit that by got a lot of stories to tell, how did you ride that far without crashing into something, man? That’s what I say to the BMX riders or something like that, right? You got to get enthusiastic about, like Pete Slotnick was another, he mastered another thing, get rid of the known time wasters. You know, the guy that has the 34 nine derailleur, and he wants to trade it for your 31 eight, but you already managed your inventory and you have what you need, right? You have the derailleur he needs it’s 40 bucks. Oh, but I only paid 30 for this one. And Can Can I just trade it and Pete would say well know, our inquiries, man is different than that. But here’s what we can do. I’ve got this one here, it’s 30 bucks. I’ll put it on the shelf back here. And if you need it, you just holler. In the meantime, I’m going to get back on this, because this customer is going to be back towards, he turned his back, smiling and walked away from the guy, the guy’s a deer in the headlights, and I’m watching my company resource payroll being used appropriately, because I want his payroll to go to the person that’s paying us. And I want him to process clients as efficiently as possible. And if there’s never going to be a deal, that’s how it’s going to be. There are really nice ways to handle it with this hyper enthusiastic smile well, and then he would finish it off by and that’s what we can offer. Well, I have it on the shelf, it’s 40 bucks. In the meantime, I gotta get back to this repair and that’s what I can offer. Turn around, walk away, and then the guy just has to make a decision. Am I gonna buy the drill you’re that’s just 10 feet. And pay the extra 10 bucks or am I just going to continue to irritate people in the world for that? $10? And if he’s that kind of a client that will irritate the heck out of someone for $10 then maybe we don’t want him but we can do it differently, can’t we? Now, Fred? Didn’t that seem like the way Pete did? It was like, you’d just be like, He’s so nice. And that guy’s gone. And he usually hangs out for half a day, pumping information, distracting McCann. So we have that obligation. We have that obligation to make sure that the time we’re building our bosses score is give them a good return on investment. How did I have a fun career? Not by being a bicycle lifestyle. I had a fun career by being the person that at 3am for three millionaires would be the guy that would could stapled the plywood to the window of the broken out store. The guy could write the check to the painting company because some guy clamped the stand on the guys beat to break $200 cycle art super restoration job. Whatever, right? That’s what I always was. So when it came to words, they always matter because unlike text and my emails when you know when you have a lot of people interacting with a lot of people. Now if I say that we fell short that, you know, some of these operations work out, but because of all that by gallery for instance, I facilitate the assembly of 10,000 bikes per year and 10,000 repairs per year. So, yeah, it’s hard to sleep at night sometimes. Are those breaks just tight? You know, is this tight? Is that tight? Always think about at night, that’s just like the stress of the surface manager. Is this tight? Is that tight? That’s all I think about at night. You know, one of our mechanic forgot to tighten the guys crank bolt properly that was left on the bench or something, he tightened it and then pulled it out for some other reason. It races up to the races. I got to tighten this bolt on your bike. I got to put the bolt back on your bike the arm was on and he somehow had the bolt on his bench. We got to go so race to crank fixing bolt. But similar type the crank was tightening. He pulled it off for some reason. So when he gets up the race site, second put that both in he goes Oh, cool I got plenty of time just finished Murray fitness training stuck on there with variable Oh, and I wanted to say the words matter Yes they do. And the other thing is we have to be hyper able to use our words to just invite people into a great experience. Me and john Friedrich you know, with this little you know SD scope crafter trying to figure out how to, like hey, we’re in charge of helping people have an experience, you know, like, I have a million dollars that one of these days on a nice sunny day. I’m going to take that free coaster bike down off the display at my local bike shop. And the owner Jess is gonna say she was there for a day Brett to like dig it Regent Street Gate Park is a skate park in my neighborhood is like world class and I would pump around or like the middle aged guy, no one would know that would they? Would you know that a middle aged guy workout best Evers get a super duper Park style BMX bike, and just go rockin in it. have escaped parked for a while just pump up and down the walls past an hour. It’s better than any stupid, you know, Stairmaster machine and then glass lined exercise places smells like people’s armpits. I’ll take out door on a bike. And there’s so many experiences to yet have read. I haven’t read a fat bike on Sam. haven’t read that bike on snow. I haven’t ridden a track bike on a track. Right. And so that was what I was gonna say. If we can facilitate go at all these different levels like hey, road bikes are cool, too. You know, I live in a motocross super town, Michigan, Washington, where my little farm is has the wushu go motocross nationals. I’m really into motorcycle too. And I have the motorcycle guys trained on bikes so it’s highly respected. And you just have to, you know, to push on the pegs and do what you need on a motorcycle. Where are you going to get that beautiful exercise, you know, so I’m having fun riding bikes and motorcycles in this wonderful area. And as soon as I moved to my farm, I wanted a new mountain bike with a dropper post. Because technologies are weird Fred and I told these youngsters at the store, I said, Do you see these pebbles on the site? I couldn’t afford the petals. And I got some current st pebbles, which are kind of the same really low profile mountain petals with all the pins in there and everything. And I also have these shoes called 510. But here’s the thing. They’re usually for, like, mountain bikers are serious with flat pedals with pins, right? And they’re phenomenal. But here’s what the kid said. That was right. He said, issues feels like clipless. And the young man was right. So then a middle aged guy, of course, you would want to buy the top of the line, you know, flat pedal type mountain shoe, because they afford all the same thing they do for the person looking for the high performance, but also protection. And, you know, the wonderful adhesion of the shoe to a pin thread. It’s so confidence inspiring. So the thing is, if you’re a middle aged guy like me that has a super fear of blunt trauma, injury and concussions and stuff, I just I want to know if there’s something that I can get That can help me from having that again. So those are some fun things. And then why shouldn’t you share that with every middle aged person? If you have a bike, I don’t care if it’s your grant, if your mother Fred, that’s riding a bike to the store, I might not put the pins up all the way. But she says, It’s raining here in Portland, my feet are always flipping off these pedals. And I’m a serious cyclist. I never want it to happen again. Well, Doug on it, maybe we could invite that opportunity, right? Like a guy like me, you’d never think that if I walked in your store. The bike that did it most for me was a Chrome, BMX bike was a free coaster, and gum tires, gum grip, I would buy instantly just for the look. But you’d never know that about a middle aged guy. So that experience, it’s the range of stuff that we want to share with our clients like, Hey, no matter what you choose to do, we’re going to honor it and support it even if it’s what we don’t do. So for instance, at bike gallery, we were in a big sophisticated bike town with our clients, all people and it’s just weird. There’s so much knowledge and so much opportunity to Dink around with bite, Chuck. Well, we weren’t Particularly committed to doing a great job with recumbents. Because we knew we couldn’t we sometimes would bring some in. But it’s hard when the staff, you know, universally aren’t perfectly knowledgeable. So we very often did referral to a place called Coventry. So we really, you know, did something like that, or if someone needs to, here’s another wonderful thing. Like, here’s how you interact with another bike shop, a client needed to camp peg parts. I said, Hey, I’d call up river city. Hey, Brandon, do you have a certain, you know, spring for this particular thing? He says, Yes, I do. Can you please hold it to this client? And they come in? Yes, I can. Right. That’s the kind of professional interaction I enjoyed for years. But when you do that for clients, but you also have it already set up at the other store with a friendly agreeable person, you know, to make and maybe spend less time there I keep coming back to you. But you know, it’s so funny when I bumped into Brandon because we our career spanned like a long, long time together as big competitors in the same town right. Top service managers of the top two shops. every interaction I had with him was like that and way Dave Ramsey’s operation is like, so fun to see how different shops achieve success. And that’s what’s fun about life business spreads. However, you’re doing it out there is fine, but just here’s the run world. Don’t be dirty. You know, can I talk about life in previous threads? Tell me when it’s appropriate. Let me make a crazy statement. I buy the tea drips off john Burke’s toilet in his basement. And I’ve seen Mike senior bear but a lot. Now, how did that happen? Well, because, you know, I worked for a big truck dealer and you know, I was able to enjoy some time in John’s backyard. And he has a wonderful home on the lake. And just like any other place when I went to the wonderful bathroom in the basement, I did my business and wiped off everybody else. He dropped just like I would because that’s how I live in the world. You know, and I don’t care. And then Mike dinner Do you know when I did some consulting for specialized, he was in that room ride bikes like every single day. Man in that locker room, you notice them getting the shorts on and going for a ride experience in the product. You know, it’s like, hey, let’s not all fight, we can all fight. You know, one the other. Everybody’s on the mission. And guess what the client don’t know nothing about these fights you silly people’s. You shouldn’t stand front. We can’t identify with brands, we are not brand aligners, we say here’s the brands we have chosen for these reasons. But once you get them, that’s where we can really shine. Once you get this stuff. See my job has always been once they have this stuff, right? It sucked. How did my skills grow? And how did I become a tool designer? Because I saw a lot of stuff getting ruined. I worked at a big operation I saw way too many frames the implant way too many saddles being altered and hopefully put back if you alter a saddle for the purpose of clamping ask permission from the client first. Then when you do ask them if the sight height they have is what is perfect. And should we record it and you know, make sure it’s put back in place, or do you need some help with that? Mm hmm. Opportunity. So You know, the BS of having to altra seatpost for the purpose of planting the perfect frame and the integrity of the finish surfaces is kind of a problem, but it should be handled first with permission then is it right and then when you do raise it turn it 90 degrees to indicate that it’s been grossly maladjusted for the purpose of servicing, which is like a jacking point. You know, make sure that we put it back to where we got it and everything we’ve touched we should improve a tune up in the tune up unless the plane bearing derail your police are swimming in oil and a little dust cap navy seal the industry required all that it required a very high level of standard and all the work that was done under my care. You know, here’s the thing when it comes to like bragging like who knows who and I, oh, I know this race or I don’t know any races and last night all the business people. I’ve been to the giant factories and into giant Phoenix and giant China factories in China, then the factories in Taiwan have been the you know, so many Shimano factory subcontractors in Japan. I don’t know the celebrities like the racist but I know the celebrity business people like I know how this stuff was made and what the barriers Here’s our here’s the barrier. We never received vehicles that are vehicle, they’re just specks in boxes. And we’re the ones that sign earnings the vehicle. So respect to john and Mike, two big guys, right? It was me that signed my name for them 10s of thousands of times, right? It’s like, I delivered the vehicles and signed the name that these vehicles were safe and sound. So that my bosses, my wonderful boss that really earned the success that they had, were protected and insulated from needs of mechanical and dangerous stuff. It’s hard. It’s hard to get 35 mechanics, you know, through seven stores and you know, like I say 10,000 transactions a year. We did really darn good. We did really darn good. But when we failed, it was so avoidable. Right. Whenever we failed, it was avoidable. You know, and by failing I mean, I had to practice for the third time and for the same problem the client has to see Brett, so I was the general service and training manager for the bike gallery stores in Port In Oregon, I started there, in 99. It’s a company that no longer exists, I can talk all I want about it and finance, I didn’t sign a nondisclosure that I can’t I’m not gonna say anything to proprietary, but when I started in 99, the service departments just limping along at the quarter million. And by the time I left in 14, it was 1.1 million with about a million dollars, you know, service payroll. So I felt really proud that we were able to cover the payroll in a service operation where the sales department, you know, gets what they get for free, basically, you know, assembly of the new product, and you know, support thereafter, right, and the use of the service department in getting the new product out the door in other ways, you know, pre delivery and post delivery stuff like that. So we just tried to make it legitimate up there. And you know, Jay did that was really cool when you’re hired yet tonight, the 99 he hired me to turn that place around and it was fun, because my first rule is say yes to everyone. When I turn a service department on I only did it twice for gene and the bike rack in Omaha. And for like Galleria in Portland, to say yes, everybody enthusiastically so and have a nice, clean, well stocked restroom that isn’t great. And try to have air conditioning that makes the climate more comfortable for the client. Those are the things I did in my life. You know, I gave a cool mechanic named Jay Z to the kid rather than being done BMX or drinking, but Dr. peppers and stuff made him look like a daggone mess that it’s hard to get hired, even though he’s the most amazing person in the world. For the client, like the most superstar like you’re the client jgs Anya, holy Look, you’re gonna have an experience, legit, because the guy just lives and breathes by. But I said, Dude, I want to get you hired. And I want to get you on down here and get to Dempsey, because you’re cheated out of so much opportunity because of that bias. You know, your smile, even though it’s kind of you know, not too great. After 15 seconds we don’t care because of your life energy bubbles. Ah, but get that handled. So that’s what I’m proud of threads that I helped mechanic get a set of teeth or, you know, hearing my proudest moment in the world was this. And it was at some seminar, I was somewhere for a company and this young mechanic comes up to me who you know, Those faces of the kids that never even lived on the street or whatever they might be 32 but they look like they’re more like 48 You know, he had a rough life. You could just tell, you know, drugs and street stuff at one point, homelessness. This is the later story, but you can just read a kid’s face, right? So he comes up to me all beaming and he says, Brett, you changed my life. That’s what he mean. He said, I’m 32 years old. I support a deaf wife. And deaf people are discriminated against. It’s hard for them to find employment. I’m proud that I can do that in the town I live. And we have a baby on the way and have a successful bike mechanic for four years or so at this shop. And it’s because of you. That’s what he’s talking about it. He said, my bosses went to one of your seminars once never young, starting the business and I remember him hadn’t even opened it yet, but they’re ready to and they were bright eyed and excited. And they said what can we do to really be successful, the best thing We can find a mechanic, you knew from an unlikely source like maybe a high school dropout or that usually you want to have some follow through, or maybe a kid that’s had a rough life or maybe it’d be a nice kid especially because if you find a BMX head type headset that’s, you know, just even from an unlikely source, find them and develop them because it’s going to take about five years. And then when you lay down your head at night, you know, then brake levers are tight. And, you know, the brake band was tightened on the coaster brake. And that if you really needed to, someone would go staple a piece of plywood over the Windows Store if you were in France, right in your dream, right? Because if you invest in them, they’ll have your back in a really great way. You know, they’ll give you loyalty. And so they took that advice and hired this chair and developed him and buys him every tool he needs and gives him a good salary and benefits and I’m proud of that. I don’t know any fancy celebrities. I don’t even remember the name, Fred. But there’s the moment that I’d love to brag about that I convinced the shop to say Holy crap, these little dirt bags, they got our back, treat them with respect because they don’t have any tools or engineering or nothing. They don’t have vehicles within the engineering protocol. We can’t plug these into a computer. No one tested, the drive trains, the brake, like crazy fluids worked out everywhere, or doesn’t. You know, it’s hard. We get no labor for what we do. We’re scratching out there on our own. So give them every resource, don’t cheat them out of tools and equipment, availability of you know, find an information they need to not screw up your customers work. It’s all about that, like you know, what I’m most proud of is 10s and 10s of thousands of invoices where I took people’s money under official banner when the business hours were open, as representative of the top examples of the brands, you know, you mentioned, you know, I was the factory factory mechanic, I had dialogue, you know, with our biggest vendor for years and years with Jeff G. And it’s like he knew who I was. He knew that if I presented something, I was competent. They didn’t treat me terribly, they really, I knew that the company that I was dealing with back here in Wisconsin, and ultimately had the clients back, you know, they really hooked me up most the time, like most of the times I’ve done it, and then that was really awesome, because then I didn’t have to worry the client didn’t need to know whether I’d get hooked up on the backside. I just said, Listen, we got to get you back out there riding again. You know, when I used to open up the training seminar bike gallery, this would be like 100 people at the no annual dealer, not that many, maybe 80. Whatever, and I get to say some, I’d say who’s the newest person here. Some poor little 19 year old dog from read or something. Raise Your Hand me the you know that right now you could if a client needed a 62 centimeter high end, you know dirt equipped road bike because there’s there’s something even lesser was being warrantied you could loan them Jay graves his bike, go to his office and to take give it to them, you know that one that signed by the you know, most world famous guy. You could give them that bike and loan it to him so he could keep riding to train for that ride that’s important to him. Did you know that you’re empowered to do that on day number one? No. I said, Jay, is that true? And he’s shaking his head. Yes. Because we have no funner time in the whole world and finding some crazy ridiculous solution to keep that plant going uninterrupted in an enthusiastic supported way where we didn’t make it hard for them. You know, that? Yeah. Don’t argue with people like they Hey, it’s hard out there. Yeah, shifting tricky. thing is really tricky. If you’re open to it, I can give you some of the stuff that I learned to make it better for me anyhow. And if that works for you, and you’re open to it, I’d share that. Otherwise, you know, here’s some things you know, that I found on the bike, because it isn’t all about you. I found some stuff. Check this out. I figured out this table tension here. Here’s the thing, clients, everybody listening to this professional. If a customer comes back to your store to turn in adjusting barrel fix shifting, you are delivering a high low, low, low, low, low level of competence in your service department. Because that my friends, notice the shape of it. It’s made for the client. The adjusting bear was made for us when I bought my bike. First thing I did is Dink around with my reach adjusters on my $4,500 retail mountain bike. Because I can’t and I know that it needs to be you know, so this stuff has to be you know, carefully managed.

Chad Pickard  54:54

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Fred Clements  55:08

Sort of a final question. I think we’re sort of getting towards the end. But you’ve worked in a multi-store chain at the bike gallery, you’ve worked in other large stores. How do you get buy-in? You mentioned you have training for your staff, you know, you have what bicolor had five or six locations, I think and what do you do as a manager to assure that each of the locations each of your people is kind of into what you’re thinking and sort of up to speed.

Brett Fleming  55:36

You fired the people that have ever had feedback that read like I felt disrespected and not listened to. Because there’s always going to be, you know, one or two of those that have been allowed to stay along too long because of competency. So at any given time, there were people sorry for when you got fired. It wasn’t a random event. It was with deep heartfelt discussion and sadness, sadness that people I couldn’t figure out how to engage with clients respectfully but so I just tell stories of how important this is to people. You know, like, Oh, I’d love the whole thing where I could just tell the story. But you just don’t know what a bike is doing for someone so enthusiastically approach every single one. As if they’re the most important person in the world that even the boss himself would come out and do this for you and make sure that it really was okay and wouldn’t send a survey later would be right at the table. You know, it kept a couple years ago we went to this nice family Italian restaurant. Oh my gosh, neat. because it’d be exact right point. The chef comes out and checked in with everybody in an earnest way. It’s very interesting with tomato sauce for a friend and you know, it was just so beautiful and the way the waiter interacted with the disabled girl, but Oh, would you like your? She said, you know, what would you like today, and she wasn’t able to Respond the disabled girl. So without a heartbeat, the server said, well, we’ll give you your regular. And that was one perfectly How can you be that good in so few seconds, you know. And you know, and when Oh, here’s the other thing, when a customer called us the same restaurant to the over busy server, and said, what you put in the bag wasn’t what I wanted. I want to say it’s not a soup and a salad. And she had the order down and everybody knew they ordered a salad. But when he got home, somebody was mad, and they both wanted to. So in a microsecond, all she said was no problem. I’ll get the order in right away. You know, no problem. I get the new order and right away, like instantly, we’re going to get you the food you want. We’re not going to talk about what you ordered, whether you’re right or wrong. And I asked her about it. And she says, Oh, it’s too easy. You get into the people’s. You see this person wants to talk this person doesn’t want To talk, I said no lady is not easy. It’s highly sophisticated, isn’t it? And she said, Yes, it is. It is. Some people want to be chatty. And some people want to get the heck out of there. Right? And you have a respect to show, find out where people are. Hey, you know, I see, you know, one another word track visit. Do you have any time constraints? You know, what are your turnaround expectations? Before we get started? We’re a little busy, we’ll have an option for you. We will have an option for you. But maybe not the fullest option to get you back on the road. Does that make sense? Never say we can’t get that tune-up. Sorry. Go away. Are you kidding, Fred? This train wreck of that entire life of that human being that went through all of those things. And though Sam’s formula, remember the time plus money equals j plus m like, Hey, we’re selling time and money, but we’re selling joy, and accomplishment and success. That’s delivered by the Macan. So that was like a philosophy a guy named Sam, somewhere in Minneapolis he could get he said Brett after seminar, you’re missing one important points is all about opportunity cost. If someone comes into your retail establishment is given up what this economist can measure as literally millions of other things. That’s what I want to end this interview with Cincinnatus. Remember, if someone came into your store, they got daycare, they got parking they got scratching their trunk from having to bring that damn thing back for a stupid adjusting barrel that you should have done. Are you kidding me and empower them to do it. So hey, you can’t go wrong with these suckers. Just grab one of these adjusting barrels and turn that sucker till it doesn’t shift and then go back clockwise again and you’ll be good to go. You know or something like that some nice way of explaining how it works. You know, you’ll be empowered when I show people that learn cycle Oregon do these clinics. And when you show people that they themselves can adjust their shifting with a cable adjustment as simple as the barrel adjuster. I’ve never had a client That their bike mechanic told them that isn’t that sad. They’re out there riding, not shifting on a vacation because it’s something they could just stop and turn something to half a turn and try it again and turn it another turn and try it again, and probably be happy. And that’s all we would have told them. So that’s where the words matters to, Hey, where are you on the scale? Do you want any words or not? Because some of them don’t want work? I want it to buy 99 you need a press developer or trade USA you need presto trader, you can say do you need pressors trader? You know, the one like on the car, or the funny one, right? You give them an out? You never put that’s another way you argue with people that you put them through all these tests. Is it Presta Schrader now? It’s hard. There’s a lot of different sizes. Oh my god, I would never shop there again. I would run out of that store. Like Why are you scolding me? I gave up everything in my life to come into a bicycle shop. Which I love bicycles, don’t you? Why are you so mean to me? I’m sensitive. You know? It’s easier No wonder the answers do Amazon equipment shift retails a bunch of mean people.

Fred Clements  1:01:06

effect breathe. One of them on my notes here from one of your seminars was a quote it is unacceptable to be a curmudgeon. And absolutely, that was pretty good. But I guess we’re pretty much done here. At least I’ve asked all that I have you know, Brett Fleming Efficient Velo Tools, email address, Brett, with two T’s at efficient vello.com Brett’s done, as obviously speaking and consulting with retailers in his tool business is what pays the bills. So thank you, Brett, for being here. Anything you wanted to add, as we wrap up here?

Brett Fleming  1:01:40

Hey, we’re trying to get hired to help people have an experience that sometimes it’s a practical experience. Sometimes it’s a joyful experience. And don’t we owe it to them to just do a little bit of an interview? Like, Think of it as an interview? It’s like, hey, you’ve given up a lot to get here. What can we know about you to make sure we do Deliver you a success because we’ve got a lot of stuff available. Even the boss’s bike. I’m serious, man. If you need to keep riding, I’m going to take the boss’s bike, dude. I mean, you’re just chained to the situation. Right? I say, Jay, I’m gonna take one of your BMX bikes. This kid’s, like, just really addicted to writing. It’s his medicine, he has ADHD and, you know, otherwise he’d be in jail. You know, who knows? Because you don’t know that story. Do your friend. That’s the main thing. You don’t know the story. Gently find out and respect people’s property, both mental and physical, and say, hey, how can we succeed for you because I’d like to get hired and help you have a great bicycle journey, or motorcycle journey or whatever it is, you know, trike journey. I don’t care if I’m a service professional. I’m trying to get hired. And you know, maybe I’m trying to get hired in my own brain to facilitate a joyful experience of gliding through the atmosphere carbon running down a trail like an animal, feeling Fast Company The goal getting to work, it’s all good. You know, and I was so happy to have procured that type of experience for so long. And here’s the greatest thing. Bosses don’t cheap out ever, and I never had to I was fully empowered. The last story is a poor woman who comes in with a custom bike custom geometry and she’s like knee short. I understand short, women’s stuff a lot because I ride their bike. When I get to test them, they’re the only ones that fit in Yeah, she had this liking we had talked about total overlap in the bike cost about 30 $500 is not an expensive custom that is mostly the frame, but that’s pretty expensive. So the chocolate overlap was tested. She tried writing at once, and it scared her. And she became fearful of the bike and never touched it for two years. And she came into the store one day with the bike and she’s crying. I get these salts, which is I’m glad I get the socks because that’s serious business and I said, Hey, what’s going on? Well, I bought this bike and I’m spooked about it. I’m just never going to Right. Even though I understood it had to clip overlap, I didn’t know what that meant. And that scares me and I’m afraid to get hurt. I said, Well, I give you all your money back. What? Yes, they do. I don’t want that out in the world. And if we blow you away like this, and just give your money back and take this terrible, terrible feeling away, all I would ask is that you tell people how it actually went down. And then we can sell the bike and recover from it so I can make that decision. And I was honored to have been empowered to be at that level in my career. Like, do you want to brag about stuff? I’m glad I could. And the one lady just changing her shifter angle 12 degrees completely, remarkably changed her shifting after we’d struggled for five different visits, to give her success when I went for a ride with her, and with the same shift and she goes, Oh my God, if you shift gears It was like, heck, yeah, baby. Let’s go for it. And we went on a fun ride. And with that, I am smiling about what it was I did for a living Fred, thanks for allowing me this interview. Thanks, listeners, whatever, if yet you do listen to this and thrive in a city joyful place to try another wonderful new employee. She has a neat little dog, whose ear is that down just to match our worthless dog here. So I’m happy and it’s funny. That’s the other thing spreads. It’s tiny and Mount Hood is out and just gorgeous. So is there anything else I need to? I’ll shut up? There you go.

Fred Clements  1:05:21

Now, I think we’re done. Thank you for it. So thank you, Brett. Thank you, NBDA. And I think we’re out for today.

Brett Fleming  1:05:28

All right, thank you so much.

Rod Judd  1:05:29

This has been bicycle retail radio by the National Bicycle Dealers Association. For more information on membership, and member benefits, join us @NBDA.com

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After spending 12 years as a writer and editor, Fred Clements worked as executive director and vice president for the National Bicycle Dealers Association for 28 years. He then moved to Interbike in a retail relations role, later transitioning into consulting. He enjoys helping the NBDA with podcasts from time to time and rides about 3,500 miles each year on his road bike.

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The NBDA has been here since 1946, representing and empowering specialty bicycle dealers in the United States through education, communications, research, advocacy, member discount programs, and promotional opportunities. As shops are facing never-before-seen circumstances, these resources offer a lifeline. Together, we will weather this. We at the NBDA will not waver in our commitment to serving our members even during this challenging time—but we need your support.

Now is the time to become a member as we join together to make one another stronger. Whether you’re a retailer or an industry partner, your membership in the NBDA is one of the best investments you’ll make this year. 

Learn more about the benefits of being a member and join now.

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The post Meet Your Customers with Aggressive Agreeability appeared first on National Bicycle Dealers Association.

E-Bikes and Building a Mission-Driven Bike Shop:  Karen Weiner and Brett Thurber opened a bike shop ten years ago in California’s Bay Area with four e-bikes on consignment, and no previous bike shop experience an asset that enabled them to bring fresh eyes and a creative approach to creating a mission-driven business model. They began by operating out of their apartment and delivering bikes by the trailer, and today, The New Wheel has two locations, an offsite service center, and 28 employees.

In this episode of Bicycle Retailer Radio, Karen Weiner talks about the challenges and benefits of being an e-bike only retailer and how they have built their business around the unique needs of the e-bike consumer. Karen also talks candidly about the tension between dealer and bike manufacturer needs and goals, and how The New Wheel leverages their service department to enhance the rider experience and build customer loyalty.

Please enjoy listening to E-Bikes and Building a Mission-Driven Bike Shop.

Support the show  (https://nbda.com/articles/donation-form-pg511.htm#!form/Donate)

The New Wheel’s MISSION

Our mission is not only to change how we get around but to bring good things and fresh ideas into the lives of people in our community and California as a whole.

We uphold our commitment to our customers through careful selection of technology, top-notch service, and an unwavering optimism for the future of transportation and electric bikes in the Bay Area.

Come visit our electric bike shops in San Francisco and Marin County.

Episode 20 – Bicycle Retail Radio

Tue, 8/18 10:41AM • 38:10

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

bike, bike shops, bicycle, electric bikes, people, ebike, customers, margins, brett, industry, store, ride, wheel, sell, riders, buy, membership, service, product, suppliers

SPEAKERS

Chad Pickard, Rod Judd, David DeKeyser, Karen Weiner

Rod Judd  00:10

You are listening to bicycle retail radio brought to you by the National Bicycle Dealers Association.

David DeKeyser  00:16

Hello and welcome to another episode of bicycle retail radio. My name is David Dekeyser. I do retail consulting for the NBDA is the P2 Consult program. You can find more information on that program and all the other great benefits the NBDA provides its members on the NBDA website NBDA calm. Today’s guest is Karen Wiener, who along with her husband, Brett Thurber, owns and operates two e-bike only retail stores in the San Francisco Bay Area. And with that welcome card, and thanks for taking some time out from what I can guess is a busy day to join us.

Karen Weiner  00:54

Thanks, David. Nice to be here.

David DeKeyser  00:56

So most of the reason tailors that are going to be listening to this probably own and operate traditional retail bicycle stores where they’re selling a wide variety of different products. Can you kind of give us a history of your business? what spurred the idea to do an e-bike only store and kind of bring us up to the present day, just to give us some background and context. And first, I want to say you’ve been open for 10 years. So congratulations on that. Yeah. If you can kind of give us a little history of your business. That would be great.

Karen Weiner  01:33

Absolutely, yeah, this will be our 10th year, but where we started doesn’t look anything like where we are today. So Brett and I met at UC Berkeley, and he was studying history and I was studying anthropology. It was 2010. And you know, we were all it was, well, no, we’ve met before that but in 2010 when Brett graduated the company economy was essentially in shambles. And we decided, well, Brett became interested in the idea of electric bikes as transportation. He was a very utilitarian bicycle, let’s just get to school get back that’s about it. Had a, you know, specialized commuter bike, and I am originally from Denmark and have been back and forth a lot and used a bicycle heavily between high school and the end of college. And so I was also sort of a practical bicyclist. But the idea of electric bikes was sort of, you know, it was on the margins of things. There were students that we were talking to at Berkeley who had come back from war, and we’re using electric bikes to get around people who are handicapped. There was an article in The New York Times that talked about these bikes that they were using for vacations and tours in the Swiss Alps. And it sounded like magic. It sounded just unbelievable. And so Brett started to look for something similar here in the Bay Area, because all of a sudden, he just realized that it was such an obvious way to get around and wasn’t really able to find much. There were a couple of very small e-bike retailers and one bicycle store that carried the track ride plus bikes. And so the truck ride plus was really the first high-quality e-bike that Bret ever tried. And when he tried to be realized, man, this is unbelievable. Why is it not big news? So first, he tried to get a job with a regular bike shop specializing in electric bikes and nobody wanted to hire him because they thought that the market was too small. And so we opened a little e-bike shop out of our apartment, we had basically four bikes on consignment that were in our little one-bedroom apartment. And my dad and Brett built u bike-powered bike trailer. And he would go around to farmers’ markets and street fairs and try to get people to try electric bikes. And then if somebody bought one, he would deliver it to their house on this trailer. And so that was you know, about the first nine months or so. And then we ended up working with a friend who was opening a bicycle rental business for tourism in San Francisco and Brett had a small wall in that shop and helped start the shop and staff at in exchange for being able to have a sort of quasi brick and mortar space. And that’s when we realized that having a location was really important because you had customers who were making big investments. So at the time, the bikes we are selling were already over $3,000 which was a Big deal. So they were making major investments. And we realized how useful it was to have, you know, a mechanic on hand and to have a brick and mortar space that people could kind of experience the whole experience. And so I graduated that year, and we decided to open the new wheel in San Francisco. And we were for once lucky because of the economy because we were able to find a really sweet spot for a pretty good deal. Finally, and the landlord decided he would take the risk on leasing to a couple of 20 I guess we were 22. At the time note, we’re 23. So the landlord took a risk on us and we opened with about $50,000 and a lot of hard work, and we’ve been growing it from there. And so now we have two stores, an off-site service center. And we have I think today we’ve got 28 employees.

David DeKeyser  06:01

Wow. That’s a lot of employees to handle.

Karen Weiner  06:06

That’s a lot of employees. Yeah. But it’s a lot of bikes. So so we sell a lot of bikes. Everybody’s very busy. You know, we’re in a pretty, we don’t have much seasonality, so we stay busy all year long, and bikes if even in the rain, people are willing to ride the bikes more than they’re willing to ride regular bikes. So, you know, 27 full-time employees is not quite enough at this point, or 28. We’re still hiring.

David DeKeyser  06:35

How big is your store’s square footage twice?

Karen Weiner  06:39

small compared to most bicycle stores, they are about 1500 square feet each depends on how you measure them. We have outdoor space on both of them in both stores that we can move bikes in and out of basically between 1500 and 2000 square feet each. Okay. Is that enough space for you? Or would you? Does it seem like there’d be a lot of elbow-rubbing going on? Yeah, so there historically was a lot of elbow-rubbing going on. So we opened our first store with just 1000 square feet. And by the time we signed a lease for the downstairs area there, I think we were doing like, I want to say almost $2 million of business out of it out of 1000 square feet, and the amount of elbow-rubbing was obscene. It was really you have to like who you work with, and you have to be driven, you know, be really patient with each other in the Bay Area. You know, we have benefits like less weather fluctuation during the year, but we’ve got some pretty serious downside to and rent is one of those. And so we don’t really have any choice. We can’t afford a bigger space. And so it’s actually a really useful challenge for us. It’s challenged us to develop a model that’s really unlike most bike shops. And it challenges us to keep our inventory moving and to slim and you know, make tough decisions. So there are benefits and it’s difficult.

Chad Pickard  08:15

Your NBDA membership helps support bicycles, retail radio, go to nba.com to join or renew your membership today.

David DeKeyser  08:27

So the basic business model that you guys have out there is, Are you trying to appeal to a broad range of e-bike consumers, you’d mentioned kind of the practical cycling, who’s kind of your core consumer that’s coming into your stores.

Karen Weiner  08:44

Our customers, for the most part, are people who are riding to work or riding for some sort of, well, so historically, our customers were very, very practical. So in San Francisco, Most of our customers are commuters or take their kids to school. There’s very little San Francisco City Life is extremely pragmatic and busy. And so you know, riding a bike is the fastest, most affordable way to get around the city. And so anybody who’s kind of thinking outside the box is our customer, essentially. So we’ve got you to know, everybody from babysitters to people who are executives to retired people to high school students to buy bikes from us

David DeKeyser  09:37

is primarily a transportation-based purchase.

Karen Weiner  09:42

Yeah, it’s a heavy transportation base. Now in our store and Larkspur. There are a lot more leaders. There’s a history of mountain biking and recreational bicycling both road and mountain that is much stronger. So we cater to a lot of people who ride by From Marin to San Francisco, you can ride across the Golden Gate Bridge. And if you ride by bike, you save about $7 per day, just on the toll that doesn’t include, you know, parking downtown or whatever. So there’s a lot of people who ride in. But then there are, you know, we have, I would say, an older demographic in Marin. Often, people who have spent their lives on bicycles and a bike have the opportunity to stay on a bicycle. And, you know, one thing that we really didn’t, weren’t involved with and didn’t see coming. Well, we saw it coming, but we, it wasn’t our race on the edge. It wasn’t our The reason for being originally is a cargo bicycle. So, you know, an electric cargo bike is about, I don’t know, hundreds of times more useful than a non-electric cargo bike, especially in a hilly place. That’s become a major part of our business after the launch of, you know, mid-drive motors by Bosch about five years ago.

David DeKeyser  10:59

So you’re I was looking at your website, which is absolutely beautiful. And I think that anybody that’s selling e-bikes should probably spend a little time on your site, it would be helpful for them to understand how you’re presenting the product. One thing that I noticed is obviously, your stores have the fairly small square footage, you carry a lot of brands, I’m assuming that you have a very kind of curated selection from each brand. Mm-hmm. Is that hard work to deal with your vendors at all Do you ever have where they would like more floor space? Or how have you kind of navigated those waters?

Karen Weiner  11:37

Yeah, I mean, you know, I think that there is well there are a couple of things that I want to touch on from what you said, right? The first thing if you do look at our website, look at it from the perspective of understanding that what we’re doing what our aim is, is not to present product, it’s to present our service. So part of our Service is the product that we carry. But that’s just part of it. And so we’re qualifying customers, as new wheel customers or not new wheel customers through our website. And that’s been a major part of our existence since before, you know since we opened. So for I think for years, we’d invested more in our websites, and we had invested in our storefronts. So that’s just sort of a little background because it’s been a very, very useful tool to make sure that the people who are coming into our store are the right people or people who are going to be interested in the services that we have to offer. And that sort of dovetails into your question about I think the relationships that we have with our vendors. Our model is, again, because we have the challenge of our natural environment, which is super hilly, super bumpy, super salt, watery, heavy use e-bike riding We simply can’t sell some types of electric bikes, I mean, customers would be really disappointed with the performance. And so we’ve always come from the perspective that our job was to curate the best bicycles for an experience here in the Bay Area. And I think, and our perspective in terms of how we work with our vendors, with our vendor partners, is that we need them to succeed and they need us to succeed. So we try to be in really close contact with them, we’re usually talking about a product, you know, way ahead of when it’s actually going to be launching so that they can have a sense of what you know what our feedback is, what our interests are, what problems are that we’ve had with a current product that we would like to see fixed on new product and if we do see that fixed, how many units we think will sell. And because we’re focused, we’re able to move quite a few units of every bike that we sell what you Don’t see on our website is that unlike most bike shops, our model is to have inside our stores, all of our bikes, our demo bikes, you don’t actually see hardly any stock bikes at all. So when people walk in, they can touch and ride and rent and kind of experience every bike that’s on the floor. And then we have a warehouse where we stock new bikes. And when you choose what bike you want, we deliver a brand new bike. And so that helps us manage floor space. And it helps us really, you know, people the test ride is the magic sauce, the secret sauce, and e-bike sales. And generally speaking, people want to buy what they’ve tried. And so you know, it’s a matter of working with suppliers long term, helping them forecast, making adjustments as needed. And, you know, working to be good partners. I’m so amazed. Seems to me in the Bike industry, there’s a lot of tension between retailers and suppliers. And of course, there are moments of total tension at the new wheel between our suppliers and ourselves as well. But it seems to me that nobody wins if anybody loses. And so these sorts of unequal power dynamics between brands and retailers, really I understand the legacy they come from but they don’t serve anyone very well going forward.

David DeKeyser  15:29

That was very well put the kind of the nuts and bolts of your business then I’m assuming with the very high cost of living, the high cost of your retail space, you also have a warehouse. The margins on e-bike product have been it’s a definitely a conversation in the traditional bike shop world. Are they enough? Are they not enough? They’re obviously higher dollar sales. Where do you stand on you have such a really a different model than the traditional bike shop? By far? What kind of margins Do you like to see? And are you able to get those?

Karen Weiner  16:11

So the new wheel started selling e-bikes and working with an e-bike. importers and distributors quite a while before. I would say before the major brands got into it at all. And I think that you know, a lot of bike shops aren’t that sure are serious about e-bikes yet. And I would argue that a lot of the major brands aren’t that short or serious about e-bikes yet either and that’s reflected in the programs and in the, you know, manufacturing and stocking decisions that are made, and so, you know, very succinctly 32% isn’t even close to enough to be able to To sell and support a rider on an E-bike for any amount of time. And I think that you know, I think it’s an unfortunate thing that, you know, regular programs are proposing margin like that I think some start as low as 28% that I’ve seen because e-bikes have the potential to completely revolutionize the bicycle industry. But at a 28% margin, it’s just not gonna happen. You know, you can’t have the staff on hand to know the product well enough. You can’t have the expertise to support the customer well enough. The customer is quite well educated because most of them have done research online. There are a lot of players online, they’re not all bicycle industry players. And there’s a lot of garbage online and so a lot of our job in the store is to re-educate riders so that they make a purchase that’s going to be you know, joyful and sustainable and profitable for the store. I don’t know if I answered your question, David.

David DeKeyser  18:07

Yes. I don’t think that you gave me the number that you love.

Karen Weiner  18:12

Basically, yeah, I think the lowest we’ve ever gone is 35%. That’s your margin. And we make up to, you know, 40 or 42%, depending on how we negotiate and what kind of preseason we’ve written and how we’re taking bikes and how we’re paying for bikes. So that’s our range.

David DeKeyser  18:35

The reason that I’m so interested in that is, I think, kind of my own background, but then right now, for kind of your traditional bike shop e-bikes are obviously what is kind of the first thing that comes out of everybody’s mouth if we start talking about what’s hot, or what’s happening or what’s coming in the future. But then retailers are struggling with the idea of the margins being so low and that there’s all of this, you know, there Higher dollar sales. So they, it’s okay that they’re lower margins. And that’s not really necessarily the case. And you said it so well, that they require a much higher level of knowledge from the salesperson. They require much more mechanical work as they kind of go through the lifecycle of that product. And that all is going to require a little higher margin in order to make everybody happy. So that’s

Karen Weiner  19:29

kind of Yeah, the customer the writer comes from a different perspective like the writer is probably most often they’re buying the most expensive bike they’ve ever bought in their life. They’re understanding it as equivalent to any you know, high dollar item that you would buy. And so they have expectations about the performance of the bike and the warranty on the bike. And there’s a lot of education that goes along with you know, the bike industry does stuff like they put crap He breaks the crappy disc pads on a bike and an E-bike rider can blow through those pads and 200 miles. Now, how do you explain to someone who just spent 40 $500 on a bike, that they have to spend $250 on brake and rotor upgrades, you know, 30 days after they buy their bike, that sort of thing is, like, just it’s a real challenge for the shop, and for the customer and for the industry as a whole like they’re shooting themselves in the foot. So my belief is that there are way too much building bikes for price points instead of building bikes that have value and showing their value through performance. And that’s just the sad state of affairs that the bike industry is in.

David DeKeyser  20:51

Well, hopefully, somebody will come. Everybody’s trying to hit that magical price point. And I think that That’s where a lot of that product development goes. And then it’s the things that you can’t see the brake pads that end up becoming a cost-saving, but then it turns into an upsetting situation, not too far down the road.

Karen Weiner  21:17

So right and it’s not only brake pads, it’s you know, the quality of the wheels, the brake pads, the, you know, drive, train all the stuff that you think you can get away with, you can’t get away with on e-bikes because if you want to keep these people on e-bikes and buying, you know, quality, proper product instead of rad power, or, you know, discount Chinese stuff, you’re gonna have to give a better rider experience and those brands are doing and you have to show yourselves to be bicycle experts. And I think too often you know, the bike industry does not show themselves as being bicycle experts to their customers.

David DeKeyser  22:00

As far as labor goes and keeping the bikes on the road, do you do anything differently than the traditional bike shop? You know, you get a 30 day warranty one year on the parts and a lifetime on the frame. And then basically, you can come back and get a tune-up if you’d like. Do you offer more of a labor or service package to kind of keep them on the road? Do you do anything of that sort?

Karen Weiner  22:24

Yeah, absolutely. So all of the bikes we sell come with a minimum two-year warranty. So that’s one of the first questions we ask a supplier when we begin negotiations with them, we just won’t carry anything that has under a two-year warranty. So the supplier most often or the supplier always covers the cost of parts replacement. Increasingly, we’re asking suppliers to cover labor, especially if there’s any sort of persistent repetition in the problems that we’re seeing. And we cover labor otherwise, A customer who purchases and he buys from us does not ever walk out having to pay for any part of a warranty. The other thing that we do is we offer what’s called a service member. So one of the important ways of keeping people on electric bikes and keeping people excited about electric bikes is sort of reframing for them what their service expectations need to be about bicycling and bikes generally, you know, in whatever way, you know, I never worked in a bicycle shop before opening new wheels. I only know what I know through personal experience in bike shops and talking to a lot of people over the last 10 years but you know, bicycle service expertise has been devalued to a really massive extent in the last many years and so what we do is we try to give some value back to the bike mechanic and to the shop. Because we know that that’s an area where we can really compete and where we really stand the chance to improving the rider’s experience on their bikes. So we sell service memberships, which are available only to customers who buy bikes from us. And that’s an annual package that covers tuneup labor, brake pad installation, tire installation, to a replacement, that sort of thing. And so those are reoccurring memberships of either 149 or 249. They actually also include we have a partnership with a roadside assistance company. And so anybody who buys one of our memberships gets roadside assistance for their e-bike. And so they have a problem. They can call a number and essentially a cab or a tow truck comes and picks up their bike and brings it to us. And so that is, you know, another one of the services that are I think, pretty well, it’s wonderful. I think we have we’ve got tons of customers who Come get service with us every year because we’re literally in touch with them saying hey, you paid for the service, bring your bike in. We’ll take it for three days turnaround, you know, a great tune-up and our goal are to have the bike as good as new back to them at the end of that and that makes people feel really good about riding their bikes.

David DeKeyser  25:18

So I’m assuming you have a fairly good sell through then on those memberships.

Karen Weiner  25:23

Yeah, we do. Okay.

Chad Pickard  25:27

NBDA is the newest program is called rides. It will increase your store revenue and customer loyalty. It’s exclusive to NBDA members, go to nbda.com and join today.

David DeKeyser  25:42

So there’s obviously we’ve talked about the differences between traditional, some of the differences between traditional bike shops and the new wheel and how it relates to e-bike sales with your kind of greenness, if you will, coming into the bicycle industry. Do you feel that that was much more of an asset than it was a liability, not knowing how you were supposed to do things in parentheses and kind of some of the institutionalized issues that we seem to have? Do you feel that that was basically an asset that you came into this fresh?

Karen Weiner  26:17

Yeah, I guess so. Ah,

David DeKeyser  26:20

because you’re doing things so differently. Yeah. I mean, it allows us to be creative, right? It allows us to think about this as a business instead of just like a bike shop, like a mission-driven business that has an important reason for being and that is motivated by things that are bigger than just like, I don’t know, we’re motivated by bigger picture stuff. And so I mean, I’m mostly thankful that we had the stroke of luck to start when we started, and that we were in our 20s and had tons And tons of energy. I mean, Brett and I worked, you know, nonstop, no vacations, seven days a week 10 to 12 hours a day for basically five and a half, six years. And I certainly couldn’t do that now and I’m just in my mid-30s, you know, but that’s what allowed us to open with a real a pretty small, initial investment. And just keep things rolling. Keep things tight, learn a lot, and keep our mind open. I certainly Yeah, I mean, sorry, I’m not being very succinct. But yes, it was a huge benefit not to know what we’re doing. You said something in there that I thought was pretty funny about You started it and we’re trying to run it like a business, not just a bike shop.

Karen Weiner  27:48

Yeah, I mean, no, I think that’s

David DeKeyser  27:51

in that statement.

Karen Weiner  27:53

I’ve had the opportunity now to work with a lot of bike shops that trim there’s a real set of cultural assumptions about running a bicycle shop. And there’s a real dynamic that has been cultivated between suppliers and retailers and riders, and between the kind of the past and the present and the future. And you know, I think that needs to be, we need to shake it up because it’s not very functional. It’s not a fun way of doing business. And fundamentally, like if you can’t pay your mechanics, a decent living wage, or you can’t have salespeople who know what they’re talking about, or able to really support riders, I think there’s a problem with the business model. Right? Well, hopefully, but there’s also this like a huge benefit. I mean, the bicycle industry is unlike really any other industry right now. Because we still have our shops, you know, and there’s still a reason for us to exist, which is service and local stores. progress in the bike industry is something that I think we all need to get much more serious about talking about. Excellent.

David DeKeyser  29:07

So as we kind of start to wind this down, one of the things that you had mentioned was that you have a bigger purpose for your business or that you feel a bigger purpose to it all. And can you kind of touch on what that means to you a little bit? And what the value that you feel that you’re adding to not just your customers, but to your community?

Karen Weiner  29:28

Um, yeah, I mean, so it’s pretty straightforward. We just have an environmental reason for existing. Any trip that you choose to take my bike or a bike rather than by car actually has a pretty profound impact on the environment. And so what e-bikes do for a landscape like the Bay Area is they make bicycling fun, easy and convenient, just like they are in Amsterdam or Copenhagen. again. So that is extremely motivating, especially because when you get people set up with the right bike, and you service that bike well and you treat your riders and your customers, well, you really stand the chance to see people rack up a lot of miles on their bikes. So it’s not unusual for our customers to put, you know, anywhere from between one and 5000 miles on their bikes per year. That’s what most people put on their bikes. And I like to say we’ve got the benefit of the odometer. Like most bike shops don’t know how many miles their customers put on their bikes. They know whether their chain is worn out or their tires are worn out. But you know, there are many factors that can relate to that. So we really get to see the impact that we’re having every day. So that’s the big picture. It’s really about changing the way people move, giving opportunities here in the United States. To make real change in something that is as entrenched as car culture as because in cities, especially riding an E-bike is just way better than riding a car.

David DeKeyser  31:15

And I’m assuming there are some cost benefits as well. I don’t live in San Francisco, but I think that owning a car and paying to park it and all the things that go along with that are much more expensive than owning an E-bike.

Karen Weiner  31:27

Yeah, there are costs, benefits, health benefits, you know, consumption benefits, stress benefits. I mean, that car is really expensive in San Francisco. There’s also bad traffic, bad parking, you’re, you know, going to get a parking ticket every now and then that sort of thing. But I kind of thing that’s only like a small, very easy to access part of it. Once people start riding bikes, you know, any bike shop, the person who listens to this podcast will understand that you know, bikes change lives. And if you are really serious about e-bikes, and you are really serious about getting people on them and helping them use them a lot, you’re just seeing a lot more lives change. And that is very motivating and very fun.

David DeKeyser  32:14

Okay, I have a curveball for you, do you? How do I put this if I want to kind of ask you where you see the E-bike, going, not just for a New Wheel, but for the bicycle industry. One of the things that I’m the most fascinated about your business is that you obviously have built interoperating very good business based just on e-bikes. And the bicycle retailers are just looking at the E-bike. There’s some that have done great with them, but many are just starting to look at those bikes and get into them. What number one, do you feel that there’s any threat to an E-bike only business, and have you ever considered doing traditional bikes, or is that just Something that would not happen. And in the next three to five years, do you see any really major changes? This is a loaded question and how your business is going. As it relates to, I guess, competition in parentheses with the traditional bicycle shops that may become more e-bike oriented.

Karen Weiner  33:22

I think two things. I don’t think the new wheel will ever carry regular bicycles. I think that one of the strategic mistakes that a lot of bike shops make and that a lot of bike manufacturers make is kind of thinking that you want to be everything to everybody. And I think that’s just a recipe for disaster. So we won’t be doing that. Do I think that the arrival of e-bikes in regular bike shops poses a threat to the new we’ll know I think that it poses an opportunity to buy shops, it also poses a number of real challenges to bike shops? And it poses the opportunity for the industry to do better. And for the new wheel to do better, the industry needs to do better, there need to be more bikes sold more ridership, more infrastructure, this needs to be a bigger topic in more places. So I hope that in three to five years, we’re talking about, you know, federal rebates for people who choose to purchase e-bikes instead of an electric car, I hope that we’re talking about, you know, massive infrastructure increases, which will help a huge number of new people get on to e-bikes. And frankly, the new wheeled can’t, can’t support a change like that in the Bay Area. by ourselves, we would need a lot more players and a lot of bike shops to get into this. But unfortunately, I don’t think that’s really how The bike industry is thinking about it. And that’s why you see those lousy margins. And the sort of this is just another part of your lineup so that you can service and serve the needs of you know, the baby boomer who walks in your store who wants to step through a bike or wants to keep riding a mountain bike or whatever. I don’t think that our industry is thinking in very visionary terms as a general rule. And so, you know, I hope that if it will have any impact, it’s to try to help people getting, you know, to help us all think in bigger ways. So you don’t have to think in the same big way. But let’s think big picture. Let’s think about what success looks like. And stop being so worried about, you know, the competition of your neighbor, or the success or failure of your neighbor. Really, we all need to find more success, and that needs to be the goal.

David DeKeyser  35:54

That’s a super refreshing answer. That was very good. Is there anything that you would like to kind of go out on in our conversation, I threw up really bad curveball questions. I apologize.

Karen Weiner  36:05

I mean, the one ad I would make there, though, is that, you know, we are already seeing competition from a little bit from bike shops a lot from online discounting brands, and also just this new micro-mobility player. So Uber and Lyft. And, you know, electric scooters and solo wheels and all this stuff. These are all essentially forms of competition. I think e-bikes are the best. for a lot of reasons. I think the bicycle platform is the best. But competition is a good competition just makes you work harder and be smarter and think bigger. So I’m very motivated by the competition.

David DeKeyser  36:48

Awesome. What is your website address? Its NewWheel.com?

Karen Weiner  36:53

No, it’s www.newwheel.net.

David DeKeyser  36:57

Okay, anybody that’s listening, I think it would be great if they checked out your website I thought that it was so unique obviously to the bicycle world, the way that it kind of navigated I really was impressed by it. As you said, it’s you’re not necessarily selling the product you were qualifying customers. And that makes much more sense when you explain that to me after I had played around in there for a little while. But, Karen, this was super fun. I wish we could keep going because I have so many more questions that I would love to ask you, but we’re pretty much out of time. But I super appreciate you coming on today. This was a lot of fun.

Karen Weiner  37:37

Thanks for having me. And yeah, let’s keep the conversation going. We all gotta, you know, grow this pie and float this boat a little bit higher. 

Rod Judd  37:45

This has been bicycle retail radio by the National Bicycle Dealers Association. For more information on membership, and member benefits, join us @ NBDA.com

David DeKeyser and his wife Rebecca Cleveland owned and operated The Bike Hub in De Pere, Wisconsin, for nearly 18 years. In 2018, they sold the business and real estate to another retailer based in a nearby community. David now writes the Positive Spin series on Bicycle Retailer and Industry News and he writes articles for the NBDA’s blog, Outspokin’. David also provides business consulting through the NBDA’s P2 Consult Program.

The NBDA has been here since 1946, representing and empowering specialty bicycle dealers in the United States through education, communications, research, advocacy, member discount programs, and promotional opportunities. As shops are facing never-before-seen circumstances, these resources offer a lifeline. Together, we will weather this. We at the NBDA will not waver in our commitment to serving our members even during this challenging time—but we need your support.

Now is the time to become a member as we join together to make one another stronger. Whether you’re a retailer or an industry partner, your membership in the NBDA is one of the best investments you’ll make this year. 

Learn more about the benefits of being a member and join now.

The post E-Bikes and Building a Mission-Driven Bike Shop appeared first on National Bicycle Dealers Association.

The NBDA has been here since 1946, representing and empowering specialty bicycle dealers in the United States through education, communications, research, advocacy, member discount programs, and promotional opportunities. As shops are facing never-before-seen circumstances, these resources offer a lifeline. Together, we will weather this. We at the NBDA will not waver in our commitment to serving our members even during this challenging time—but we need your support.

Now is the time to become a member as we join together to make one another stronger. Whether you’re a retailer or an industry partner, your membership in the NBDA is one of the best investments you’ll make this year. 

Learn more about the benefits of being a member and join now.

The post Get off the Phone, Get More Customers appeared first on National Bicycle Dealers Association.

To enhance the bike retail experience with online booking has become the new norm. Before the “corona economy,” online booking was already on the retail scene. Using an online concierge from the Genius Bar to yoga classes is now the first step for premium retail experiences. That said, it has not been adopted by bike retailers at scale. While appointment-only offerings have emerged recently due to local pandemic directives, online appointments are not the norm at bike shops.

Given the new realities of Coronavirus, every process and daily routine is subject to review. The bike industry is no exception – and our retail experience deserves a better step one. In this article, I will discuss how the future was already in motion before our new normal. Most importantly, you’ll learn about how online booking satisfies customer expectations while making your life easier.

2020 BC (Before Coronavirus): Customer Expectations, Retail Challenges

Let’s start with the understatement of the year – a lot has changed in the past few months. While many of these changes feel unexpected, some of our pandemic routines were already present in our old normal. In other words, the arrival of Coronavirus just accelerated our urgency to adopt them.

For example, we’ve all fallen victim to “The Amazon Effect.” Simply put, we have fewer reasons to leave our homes or go outside. Furthermore, the convenience of e-commerce has undercut the value of one-to-one expertise that used to belong exclusively to retailers.

Collectively, these changes present several challenges for bike retailers. For instance, few online booking or e-commerce solutions are universally accessible. As a result, retailers often resort to DIY solutions that only get halfway there. However, we usually end up doing things the same old way due to a lack of resources.

The New Normal = The Best Thing For Bikes In A Long Time

Breaking news – we’re in a bike boom! Outside of inventory frustrations, there’s never been a better time to be in our work line. As we’ve seen everywhere, people are seeking outdoor activities to break free from quarantine life. Also, bikes are supplanting public transit systems due to sanitary concerns on buses and trains.

Most importantly, retailers are the go-to spot to get a new bike or get their old rig fixed. Bike shops are essential businesses in every sense of the term. However, the onslaught of demand causes us to put in crazy hours and to scramble to find ways of staying sane.

Here’s the good news – online booking is here to help. Furthermore, this isn’t just a short-term fix to get you through the boom. Before everything changed, the use of online concierge services was already becoming the new normal for retail. In short, using an online appointment calendar will pay off in more ways than one.

Online Booking: Meeting Customer Expectations, Increasing Your Accessibility

First, everyone likes to feel special – and having a confirmed appointment to meet with a salesperson or mechanic builds instant credibility. Simply put, online booking is the new step one for premium retail experiences. From the quality of the product on your floor to the level of service you provide, bike shops are a premium retail business.

However, online booking’s advantages do not end with enhancing customer perceptions. Instead of waiting for walk-ins, retailers can plan out their day much more effectively to get the most out of their staff. From adjusting schedules to align with peak traffic to preparing the team for the day ahead, there will be much less waiting for the phone to ring.

Beyond your shop floor, virtual appointments represent a whole new way to connect with customers. We all know how frustrating it is to be on the phone, trying to diagnose a service issue or describing every bike you have on the floor. With video conferencing, retailers can enable virtual sales to “walk the floor” with a customer or virtual service with a mechanic examining a customer’s bike using a smartphone. Even if customers can’t be there in person, you can now bring the store directly to them.

The Future Is Now – Online Is Your Friend

More than most, the bike industry has grappled with the best way to adopt digital solutions. However, the “iLifestyle” does not mean the end of retail. Instead, tools like online booking platforms enable retailers to reach more customers more efficiently. From real-time calendar reservations to direct links on social channels, it’s never been easier to expand your reach.

People are more motivated to get out on bikes than ever before. However, their expectations for how they get out on bicycles are not the same – and that was true before the pandemic. We can use technology to bring the best aspects of premium retail to our customers – which will never be replicated on Amazon.

In the words of a retail veteran, “we were thinking about doing this in 1 or 2 years. Instead, we’ve done it in the last two days.” We’ve all experienced several years’ worth of radical change in the span of a few months. However, introducing simple solutions like online booking can provide retailers and customers alike with a great experience from start to finish.

Words by Colby Marple

About The Author: Colby Marple is the Director of Retail Solutions at Spinlister. Before joining Spinlister, Colby has worked for 15+ years in the bike industry – beginning at Sid’s Bikes NYC before joining Cycling Sports Group (CSG). Following six years at CSG, Colby joined The Leukemia & Lymphoma Society (LLS). He worked for Team In Training – the world’s most extensive endurance sports fundraising program to support cancer research. Originally from Brooklyn, Colby now lives in Norwalk, CT, and looks after Roubaix (his 2-year-old French Bulldog).

The NBDA has been here since 1946, representing and empowering specialty bicycle dealers in the United States through education, communications, research, advocacy, member discount programs, and promotional opportunities. As shops are facing never-before-seen circumstances, these resources offer a lifeline. Together, we will weather this. We at the NBDA will not waver in our commitment to serving our members even during this challenging time—but we need your support.

Now is the time to become a member as we join together to make one another stronger. Whether you’re a retailer or an industry partner, your membership in the NBDA is one of the best investments you’ll make this year. 

Learn more about the benefits of being a member and join now.

Contact Rachelle Schouten, Development Director, at Rachelle@NBDA.com for more information about the NBDA.

The post How to Enhance the Bike Retail Experience: Online Booking appeared first on National Bicycle Dealers Association.

IRVINE, Calif. – September 17, 2019 – The National Bicycle Dealers Association (NBDA), the nonprofit organization that leads bicycle retailers to excellence, has launched a turnkey extended warranty and service program for its members called “RIDES”. The name is an acronym for Ride It Daily Extended Service, and the program is offered in partnership with Ensure Protect, a national third-party administrator (TPA) headed by Frank McMillan.

“With RIDES, our member shops can give customers added value and more peace of mind, while earning revenue on the up-front premium payments, driving business to their own service departments, and being fully reimbursed for their labor,” said Brandee Lepak, NBDA president. “There’s no cost to our members, and it gives them a terrific value proposition to offer customers. It’s a win-win.”

RIDES, which is offered as a one-time purchase to the customer at the time of a bike sale, functions like AppleCare plus and similar protection packages. Program premiums, based on a bicycle’s sale price, start at $4.99 and are shared 50/50 between shops and Ensure Protect, creating a pure profit revenue stream for participating dealers.

Three coverage options are available through RIDES: a replacement plan that covers the one-time replacement of a bicycle, a repair plan that covers 100% of parts and labor, and a repair and maintenance plan that covers 100% of parts, labor, and scheduled maintenance.

The plan terms of either one or two years begin when the manufacturer’s warranty ends. Customers can bring their bikes to any participating RIDES shop in the country for service under their plans. RIDES reimburses each participating dealer at full shop rates for repairs and maintenance. The plans are convenient, transferable, and renewable.

Ensure Protect will oversee the program’s administration and regulatory compliance and implement a rollout plan in conjunction with the NBDA. The program start date is slated for September 17, 2019. More information is available at www.nbda.com.

“Our data confirms that 20% of people always buy extended service attachments, and 50% of people buy them some of the time,” summarized Ensure Protect’s, Frank McMillan. “So, the RIDES program not only makes it possible for dealers to satisfy and retain their customers, it creates two new revenue streams: the premium, and the service work.”

For more information about RIDES and to sign up, please visit https://nbda.com/articles/rides-ride-it-daily-extended-service-pg518.htm, and for more information about the NBDA, please visit www.nbda.com.

# # #

The NBDA has been here since 1946, representing and empowering specialty bicycle dealers in the United States through education, communications, research, advocacy, member discount programs, and promotional opportunities. As shops are facing never-before-seen circumstances, these resources offer a lifeline. Together, we will weather this. We at the NBDA will not waver in our commitment to serving our members even during this challenging time—but we need your support.

Now is the time to become a member as we join together to make one another stronger. Whether you’re a retailer or an industry partner, your membership in the NBDA is one of the best investments you’ll make this year. 

Learn more about the benefits of being a member and join now.

The post Extended Service Program: NBDA Rolls Out RIDES appeared first on National Bicycle Dealers Association.

Step 1: Get a Bird’ s-Eye View

To help the department live up to its potential, step back, and look at service strategically. One of the most common mistakes we see is shops that rush into changing things solely, it seems, for the sake of changing things. It’s fun to jump in, swing hammers, and create exciting new features in the store, but it takes proper planning to avoid making changes that hurt rather than help you. Analyzing the store, asking tough questions, and coming up with a plan isn’t sexy, but using the following steps as a guide will make the process easier, fun, and, most importantly, more effective.

Even if you don’t have the fancy kind of floor plan Fixture Lab generates for its customers, it’s still vital to create even a simple one, so you can see how your service area impacts the rest of the store. If you’re creating one from scratch, try using graph paper to draw an accurate representation of your whole space, where each square represents one square foot. Include bikes on the plan—being careful to draw bikes accurately to scale and indicate the product on display.

Start with a floor plan of the current store layout, which will help you get a firm grip on how much space everything takes. Once you have the as-is idea, it’ll be easy to draw variations that explore solutions in different ways. Don’t skip this part. It’s free to change your mind on paper, but it’s much more expensive once you start tearing walls down and moving things.

You don’t want to fix things that aren’t broken, so it’s also a great idea to look at the numbers for your store before you start remodeling. As you look at numbers, ask yourself these questions:

• What does service mean to the store financially? What could it mean if we were doing things even better?
• If we’re underperforming, is it because we haven’t priced our services, right?
• How long does the typical service transaction take? If we increased it, what would the effect be?
• How much does our service business vary, from day to day or hour to hour?
• How do we/will we measure the efficiency of service?
• Would a change to the service department mean displacing other profitable things?
• If we create an open service area, will it serve people to view customers cost us more?

Step 2: Observe the Store

You guessed it. This is another time when stepping back and looking at the store with fresh eyes is super smart. Take time to watch the flow of customers through the store.

Hot tip: Shooting a few days of time-lapse footage in the store is pretty easy, and can help you quickly identify customer behavioral patterns that you miss in real-time. There are plenty of simple, affordable time-lapse cameras available on the market, including the Brinno TLC200.

Ask yourself these questions as you watch:

• What are the primary paths that customers and employees take?
• Where do people tend to bunch up?
• Are there physical barriers in the space?
• Do customers figure out where to go quickly?
• What would our ideal customer need/want in the area?

The answers aren’t always what you’d expect. Sometimes it’s as simple as bike rentals causing a logjam. Sometimes customers are parked in the service area too long (in which case making the area even comfier could hurt you). Maybe your service staff is too distracted when customers are nearby. Or perhaps service isn’t your real problem at all. Maybe you don’t have adequate space in the back for completed service bikes to transition to, and they clog valuable space in the service area. Or maybe the problem is that your customers are lost, or you don’t know how to help your efficiency. If that’s the case, then your solution might be as simple as improved signage.

Step 3: Make Sure You’ve Mastered the Basics

Metaphorically speaking, everyone wants to run down the court and slam-dunk the ball. The problem is that you can’t win the game by doing just that. You need to play good defense, and you need to be proficient at the necessary shots, or you’ll never win the game. In a bike shop, it just doesn’t make sense to build a new service area with fancy digital displays, reclaimed wood walls, and gorgeous steel countertops if your staff is impolite, or your quality of service isn’t consistently top-notch.

Don’t bother redesigning your service area until you have these basics down pat:

• Clean up!
• Create best practice guidelines for employees and consistently enforce the rules.
• Don’t clutter the space with bikes or anything else that isn’t mission-critical for your transactions.
• Provide clear signage for services offered, prices, and shop procedures.

“We see shops putting more emphasis on their service department these days—hiring more people, increasing the department’s size, and moving it into more prominent locations in the store.”

— Jeff Donaldson, Barnett Bicycle Institute

Step 4: Get to It!

Well, maybe it’s not quite that simple. But now that you’ve spent a good deal of time assessing the layout and flow of your store, you’re better equipped to formulate a plan that will make your service department more efficient and, one hopes, more profitable. Even so, there are plenty of pitfalls that can trap unsuspecting retailers as they consider a redesign. Here are some of the most common design solutions we see that are best implemented with caution, a few common mistakes, and what you should be considering to make sure you’re doing what’s best for business.

Solution #1: Moving the Service Department

There’s an exciting trend of shops moving their service departments to more prominent locations, such as the center of the store, or even closer to the front door. But you shouldn’t necessarily follow suit, unless you’re changing over to a selling model with a more open floor plan, or need to incorporate the staff that will build and works on bikes into the middle of things. Be careful not to rush into this solution, though, as it may create more problems than it solves.

If you simply want to make the service department stand out more, you have plenty of more straightforward solutions to try before supplanting your most valuable retail real estate:

• Clear visual obstructions/clean up the path to it (and don’t ignore the fact that while hanging bikes frees up floor space, it can block important sightlines)
• Improve signage
• Improve the localized aesthetics, so that service attracts the eye

Solution #2: Expanding Service

If your service department is already busting at the seams, then you should be making moves to relieve that pressure, since the forecast for bicycle service is bright into the foreseeable future.

You should also be careful to consider whether your problems are indeed an issue of department size. If your area feels too small, but it’s because you leave too many service bikes in the area after the customer leaves the store, then your solution might be to handle the processing of the bikes better. Another common mistake we see is shops placing too much product inside the service area itself. It’s great to have the product close-at-hand, but if it’s clogging the smooth operation of the area, you owe it to yourself to try moving the product first.

Solution #3: Showing Too Much of Service

If you want the department seen from all parts of the store, you could move it to the middle of the store. There are a few stores around the country that do an excellent job of creating great theater to expose the department entirely, but it’s not the right choice for every store.

Exposing the service area is a good idea if:

• You enjoy having customers actively participating in (or working on) the repair process
• Your store is great at keeping the department clean and organized
• Budgetarily, the same people, need to work in service and watch the rest of the retail space

Exposing the service area is not a good idea if:

• Your employees tend to be messy
• Your service business varies greatly from day to day (during slow times, a vacant service area doesn’t look great)
• Your employees are prone to distraction
• Some of your service staff seems a bit rough around the edges

I feel that there are very few stores where exposing the entire service department makes sense. I love a bit of service theater in just about every store, but many day-to-day parts of service just aren’t pretty, so they shouldn’t be on display.

Hot tip: Sometimes, a simple window between the service department and the rest of the store can create the perfect amount of service theater, without fully exposing the less-than-pretty side of service.

Solution #4: Giving Service Its Door

You may want a separate entrance that allows service customers to get in and out efficiently—and it’s often feasible to put an outside door next to your service department. Beware, though. Giving customers a short path between the door and the service department severely limits their exposure to all the great stuff you’re selling. That’s why grocery stores don’t put milk near the front of the store. Sure, it’s a bit of a chore for your customers to walk their repair bikes through the store to the service department, but think of all the fantastic selling opportunities you can present. Especially if you seize the chance to be entertaining, and offer them fun products.

Mistake #1: Letting a Service Person Design the Department

There are a few things you can count on in life—death, taxes, and that if a service person designs a store, the service department will be too big. They need room to do their job, of course, but your store needs a great retail space. We typically shoot for the non-customer-facing areas of the store (which usually includes service) to be 30-40% of the total square footage. It’ll vary from store to store, but striking an appropriate balance between retail space and backrooms/service is vital.

Similar to this can help you identify potential “logjams” that might otherwise impede your store’s flow and lower its efficiency.”

A heat map similar to this can help you identify potential “logjams” that might otherwise impede your store’s flow, and lower its efficiency.

Mistake #2: Ignoring Logjams

A logjam is where people or products—or sometimes just junk—pile up, preventing smooth flow and easy transactions. It’s the door to the backroom that’s too close to the service counter. It’s the narrow spot between bike displays. It’s the skinny doorway or stairway that’s nearly impossible to get a bike through. The service department is prone to these challenges, so if you’re looking to improve the design of that area, use your floor plan to assess—and relieve—logjams across the store. It’s entirely possible that your whole service department remodel might only require widening the doorway between service and storage to 6 feet, a simple move that can free up the entire area. When planning, shoot for all of your doors, hallways, and spaces between counters and walls to be a minimum of 4 feet wide. It’s not easy to puzzle out, but this kind of space allocation is worth it for your space’s efficiency.

Frequently, we create heat map overlays for our floor plans that show where people will concentrate. Even if you don’t go so far, thinking about the floor plan in this way is valuable. Way too often, floor plans crowd customers into one or two areas that become clogged. With this perspective, you might see that the best change you could make for the service department’s sake is to place another transaction counter in a different part of the store.

Mistake #3: Displaying Product in the Service Area

Displaying products in and around a service department is mission-critical. The transactions that take place in the area present unique opportunities to increase sales in a big way. But you need to be strategic. Don’t create displays that become inaccessible when customers are in the space. Keep those displays close-at-hand, but don’t put them where a customer’s body easily blocks them. While a glass-front case nearby is perfect, we call those outdated glass case counters “product coffins,” because that’s where otherwise good products go to die.

Mistake #4: Ignoring the Ugly Stuff

One of the most common problems when stores plan their space is not creating places for the ugly stuff in the service department. The day you finish the service department redesign is likely the cleanest, most organized day of its life, but minutes after you finish, the challenges sneak right back in. Make sure you’re honest with yourself about the way work needs to happen in that space on a busy Saturday, and give yourself the features necessary to make it work, and remain attractive:

• Nobody wants a big trash can in the floor plan, but it’s a lot better than a tiny one that’s continually overflowing.
• Countertops naturally collect crap, so create spaces to hide the ugly stuff from the customers’ view.
• Tools, bottles, cables, tubes, parts, etc. are almost always real eyesores, so put doors on the service cabinets/benches that face the customer. For the same reason, consider cabinets instead of open shelves in areas that the customer can see.

In the context of a service department, tools aren’t ugly, unless they’re scattered all over the place. There are different schools of thought on this topic, but we prefer to put tools on display on the pegboard in a very logical and organized way, rather than putting them in drawers where they’re out of sight. In our experience, the commonly used tools in drawers rarely make it back to the drawer in a day. If the tools aren’t in the drawers, then they’re sitting out, and usually scattered all over the place. We find that the odds of them making their way back to pegboard are way higher, making space look markedly better.

“A well organized, well-planned repair area, whether in a pro shop, at home, in a shed, or at a trailhead, needs to have tools in logical spots, so they’re easy to see, reach and use.”

— Park Tool, Shop Rag, Issue 15

Mistake #5: Assuming Your Customers Know What You Do/How You Do It

More often than not, this is a simple signage problem. The challenge of displaying useful information for your customers in a service department has existed as long as service departments have. The goal with graphics and signage in the service department isn’t to replace the employee’s communication; it speeds up the transaction. If a customer can quickly read a sign and ask a more informed question of your staff member, you’ll save time, and the customer feels more empowered. Don’t overwhelm your customers with too much to read, but give them vital information that helps them ask great questions. Don’t forget to brag a bit about the certifications you have, and the fantastic people in your store. Spread the word about how critical certified mechanics are in these days of online sales. One last note about signage: Have fun with it! You’re selling and servicing the most fun product in the world. No customer will be offended if your department has a great personality and/or gets their heart-pounding to get out and ride.

This post was authored by Brian Hawkins, President and Owner of Fixture Lab, and Strong supporter of Project Bike Tech. Fixture Lab provides excellent retail store design services and retail store fixture solutions that are unique to the cycling industry. Project Bike Tech creates amazing bike shop classes in high schools all over the country.

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